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Talk 15 – What About the Church? Duration 30 MinutesHTB Transcripts

Key:

P – Personal story that Nicky Gumbel tells in his Alpha talk. These may be replaced with a live speaker’s personal story or the speaker may tell the story about Nicky in the same way Nicky tells stories about others.

S/S* – Story that Nicky tells about someone else (about a friend or a story he heard or read about). Stories marked in the margin with a * symbol are key stories and should not be omitted from the talk.

Q/Q* – Quotes are key to the talk to emphasise a point and to enable guests to engage and relate the material. We acknowledge that some of the people quoted may not be well known in your local context, however, please be mindful of the value of what is said in the quoted material; not just the guests’ knowledge of the person being quoted. If you choose to replace a quote, it should be replaced with something equally effective to maintain the balance of teaching, story, and references to other information sources. In general, we encourage you not to omit or replace quotes unless absolutely necessary. Quotes marked in the margin with a * symbol are key quotes and should not be omitted from the talk.

Key Bible Passages are identified and you may wish to display these visually for your guests.

Red type identifies a part of the key teaching text that could be removed or altered for contextualisation.Text left untouched is the standard key message content of the Alpha talk.

Talk summary: People often associate church with boring services and buildings – but in the New Testament

there are over 100 images of the church The church is rich in meaning and history. This talk seeks to look at just five images that make

the church special. This is best presented from a personal point of view to present a glimpse of what the church means to you

Friends – the small group on Alpha is like church in microcosm. Jesus said, ‘I call you friends.’ But we are also called to friendship with each other. We cannot live the Christian life alone. We need one another

Family – church is not an organisation you join, but a family where you belong; brothers and sisters in Christ. Baptism is a mark of belonging to the church

Home – not a physical building but a building made up of people Jesus – Christ’s body to the world. The church represents Jesus. We should be united Love – The church should be famous for its love. It is not a museum that displays perfect

people, but a hospital, which welcomes the hurt and the broken. Service is an expression of our love

NOTE: Parts of the talk may need to be contextualised for other contexts or cultures but make sure you maintain the key elements of humour and personal testimony. Notice how quotes, and stories are used throughout to add emphasis to the main points of the talk (theology and testimony).

KEY: Personal Story Story Quotes Key Bible Passages

15) What About the Church? - Nicky Gumbel - HTB Alpha

OPTIONAL VOX POPS (English Language only): If you wish to play vox pops (street interviews related to the subject) as a way of introducing the theme of the talk.

For this talk the questions asked were: What do you think of the church? How often do you go to church?

They can be accessed via the following link: Talk 15 Vox Pops

Personalise the text in red.

If possible, personalise the text in red, or generalise it, eg, ‘Many people associate church with two things: First, boring services…Second, buildings…’

I love our small group. Small group for me on Alpha is always the highlight of the evening. I love the people in our small group this term. I’m always so excited to see them. If someone doesn’t turn up, I’m always really disappointed! We’ve had a lot of fun together. We’ve laughed together. We’ve really got to know each other well. And I hope we become friends. Certainly I feel that they are my friends.

And if I’m honest, when I looked around the first night, I didn’t think that would be the case! I don’t know how you felt about your small group. But if you’ve experienced anything like what I’ve experienced in the small group, you’ve experienced something of what it means to be church. Of course, church is much more than just a small group on Alpha. But in a small group on Alpha you get a taste of what church is all about. And that’s why I love church.

And that’s really changed for me. Because I didn’t like anything about church. Before I was a Christian, what I associated with church was, first of all, boring services.

Q I came across something that Abraham Lincoln once said and I had sympathy with this. He said this: ‘If all the people who fell asleep in church on Sunday morning were laid out end to end, they would be a great deal more comfortable.’

Personalise the text in red. Second association I had with church was buildings! Of course, there are many beautiful church buildings. But do you know that for the first 300 years of the church’s life there were no church buildings? So that’s not what church is about. That’s not the



https://youtu.be/U6A1nViglbc?list=PLC1EED7x3f1k5uf99Oo-HoXXsvyp3HWM6

essence of church.

It’s a bit like marriage. You say, ‘What’s marriage about? Well, it’s a ring, a marriage certificate.’ Yes, but those are the trappings. That’s not the essence of what marriage is about. At the heart of it is something much more profound. And at the heart of the church is something really amazing and beautiful and just glorious, actually!

And what I want to do today is just look at some of the images. In the New Testament there are over 100 images and metaphors about the church, and we couldn’t even begin to look at all of those today. But I want us just to dip a toe in the water. This is not a theology of the church, this isn’t even an introduction to a theology of the church; it’s like an introduction to an introduction! It’s just a little taste. And I want to choose five words, which are the reason why I love the church, or some of the reasons why I love the church. And here is the first one:

Talk Point 1FRIENDS

It’s the word friends. Jesus said this:

John 15:15 ‘I call you my friends.’


That’s what he says to you: ‘I call you my friends.’ Isn’t that amazing: to be a friend of Jesus! And we’re called not just to friendship with Jesus but friendship with one another. And that’s what’s so amazing. That’s what I have loved so much about the small groups that I’ve been involved in.

P This is the 73rd small group in a row that Pippa and I have been involved in with Alpha, and on every single one we have loved it.



Replace with your own personal experience.

We’ve loved the people, and so often they’ve become really, really close friends of ours.

Sometimes the groups are bigger, sometimes they’re smaller – it really doesn’t matter.

SYou can use this story by amending the personal references, or alternatively replace with your own similar example.

Someone came up to me at the end of an evening service here a few weeks ago and they said that they were slightly disappointed that in their Alpha small group they only had two people. So I said, ‘Well, what did you do?’ They said, ‘Well, one of us asked the questions and the other one answered them!’ I said, ‘How did you get on?’ They said, ‘Oh, we got on really well. We both became Christians, and we’re getting married to each other in August!’

So it doesn’t matter what size the group is, but there’s something that happens. There’s something amazing about this friendship. And the word that’s used in the New Testament, it’s really hard to translate this word: it’s koinonia. It means ‘fellowship’.

It was used in the marriage relationship, and it’s a depth of relationship that cuts across all age, ethnicity, background, culture, personality types. This level of connection that is so amazing, it’s different from being a Facebook friend. There’s something— I’ve experienced in the church a level of friendship that I never experienced outside of the church.

And we need one another. We need our friends. Someone said this: ‘There are two things you can’t do alone. You can’t get married alone, and you can’t be a Christian alone.’

Q Pope Francis said this: ‘Being a Christian means belonging to the church.’

And the writer of Hebrews says this:



Hebrews 10:25 ‘Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another.’

In other words, he says, ‘Some people just give up. Like Alpha’s just a course. Do it for ten weeks, and that’s it.’ But the writer of Hebrews says, ‘Don’t do that. Don’t give up meeting together, but encourage one another.’ Because your faith will never survive on your own – it will dwindle.

S* I heard about one young man. He’d had a faith at one time, but he felt that was losing it. So he went to see this older man, a wise Christian man, and he was in a cottage in the country and there was a fire in the fireplace. And as they were sitting there, and he’d asked his advice, he didn’t say anything – he just went to the fire with a pair of tongs and he took out a red-hot coal. That’s how we’re meant to be with our faith: red-hot. He took out the coal and he put it on the hearth. And very soon that glow had gone. It had gone like dead.

And then, without saying anything again, he just went with the tongs, picked up the coal, put it back in the fire. In a few minutes it was glowing again, red-hot. And the young man understood perfectly well why he had lost his enthusiasm: because we need one another.

We need to encourage one another. That’s what we do. I don’t know whether you’ve found that, but I found that just coming together with friends, it’s so encouraging.

Talk Point 2FAMILY



Second word is, in a way, even more amazing: not only friends but family! We are the family of God. The church is not an organisation that you join; it’s a family where you belong. St John writes this:

1 John 5:1 ‘Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God’ – in other words, you are a child of God: God is your Father – ‘and everyone who loves the father loves his child as well.’

Omit the text in red if it is not relevant to your context.

You can’t say you love God but you don’t like his children, you don’t like the church. God is your Father, and that makes you brothers and sisters. Have a look round: these are your brothers and sisters. None of you have moved at all – you’re so British! Have a look round! These are your brothers and sisters. And if you’re not a Christian yet, they are your potential brothers and sisters. I don’t know whether that puts you off becoming a Christian!

God’s intention was to bring the whole human race together as a family united around Christ. And becoming a member is not by birth but by rebirth. Jesus talked about being born of water and the Spirit. Jesus was baptised, and he commanded his disciples to baptise.

Becoming a Christian involves three things. First of all, something God does: God gives you the Holy Spirit. Secondly, something you do: you repent and believe. And thirdly, something the church does: and that’s to baptise.

Baptism is the mark of being a member of the church. And it symbolises washing, being cleansed – the water is cleansing, like we were cleansed through the blood of Jesus on the cross. It also symbolises the Holy Spirit. Jesus says: ‘Out of your innermost being will flow rivers of living water.’ By this he meant the Spirit ,



The text in red depicts a visual illustration of what is being said. If not demonstrating this visually, omit the red text. If you do the illustration you will need a piece of paper and a Bible.

the Holy Spirit.

And then it also symbolises dying and rising with Christ. So Paul uses this image. He says when you’re baptised – if this piece of paper represents you and this Bible represents Jesus – he says you’re baptised into Christ. So everything that happens to this book, it also happens to the piece of paper. So Paul says:

Romans 6:3–4 ‘... all of us who were baptised into Christ Jesus’ – in this mystical way – ‘were baptised into his death’; when Jesus died on the cross, you died.

‘We were buried with him’ – when Jesus was buried, you were buried: old life gone – ‘through baptism into his death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead’ – when Jesus was raised from the dead – ‘you were raised to a new life’.

We too may live a new life.

POmit or replace with your own story. If you omit the story, retain the text in red.

One time I was walking around Clapham Common, and I heard someone shout, ‘Nick!’ and I looked up. He said, ‘You Nicky Gumbel?’ I said, ‘Yeah.’ He said, ‘Alpha course!’ I said, ‘Yeah.’ He said, ‘Wait there!’ So I waited, and he came down. He said, ‘Hello, my name’s Dave. I did Alpha in prison. I was serving fifteen years for armed robbery. Do you want to come inside?’ So I said, ‘Er, let’s chat out here, shall we?’

And he told me his story. And we became friends. I bumped into him on another occasion. I said, ‘Dave, where are you off to?’ He said, ‘I’m off to be baptised.’ I said, ‘Dave, think of this: as you go down under those waters, your old life has completely gone. And as you come up out of the water, think: a new life has begun!’



Talk Point 3HOME

Personalise the text in red. I love church because it’s my friends. I love it because it’s my family. And then I love it because of this other word that’s used in the New Testament: it’s home.

In the Old Testament, the physical temple was God’s home. That’s the place of his presence. That’s why people loved it so much. In the New Testament, it’s not a physical building – it’s a building made up of people.

Ephesians 2:21–22 So Paul talks about ‘a holy temple... you too are being built together to become a dwelling in which God lives by his Spirit’.

Replace, amend or omit the text in red according to your experience.

Jesus said: ‘Where two or three are gathered in my name, there I am in the middle, in the midst.’ In other words, when the church comes together like this, the whole Trinity’s there – God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Spirit.

And that’s why it’s so amazing. Sometimes people walk into a church and they’ll say, ‘Wow, there’s an amazing atmosphere here!’ What are they sensing? The Holy Spirit, Jesus, the presence of God. And that is amazing.

The church is God’s home.

I love the fact— Hillsong Church: I went to Hillsong Church in Australia, and it really struck me that they had this huge mat at the entrance of the church which said: ‘WELCOME HOME’.

Q I interviewed Cardinal Schönborn, who’s the head of the Austrian Catholic Church, at the Royal Albert Hall a couple of years ago, and



I’ll never forget what he said. He said, ‘I feel this deep in my heart. This is what I feel the Lord is saying, this is what I sense that God is doing here: it’s like God is saying, “Come home! I wait for you.”’

There’s something amazing about coming home to be refreshed, revived, reinvigorated, re-energised. And that’s what the early church did: they came together for those things. It was like coming home. And when they came together, what they did was they devoted themselves to the apostles’ teaching – the equivalent for us would be hearing the Bible expounded; to the fellowship – to this friendship that is so encouraging; to the breaking of bread – to communion; to prayer – praying for one another included in that.

And church is designed to be a place where people come, and are not judged, but they’re loved, accepted and welcomed home.

Talk Point 4JESUS

Personalise the text in red. The fourth reason that I love the church, the fourth word is the word Jesus. St Paul says this:

1 Corinthians 12:27 Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is part of it.’

He says like, Jesus is the head, you’re the body, and together you make up Jesus to the world. This is how the world will see Jesus: through you.

Jesus never wrote a book; he formed a community. He started with a small group, and that small group grew rapidly. For 2,000 years it’s been growing. And the universal church consists of all those worldwide and down the ages who profess the name of




Christ.

And it’s vast. There are now 2,300 million Christians in the world. I used to think the church was declining: nothing could be further from the truth. I read some statistics recently that since 1970 the Christian church has grown by over 1 billion: 1,000 million new Christians. Tens of thousands of people are becoming Christians every day. Today, tens of thousands of people around the world became Christians.

Of course, we’ve had a bit of decline in Western Europe where we live, and therefore it’s easy to think, ‘Oh, the church is in decline.’ But that’s not representative of what’s happening globally.

Look at what’s happening in Latin America.

POmit or generalize this story: ‘I heard of a pastor/vicar who went to a Catholic Church in Latin America at the invitation of Cardinal Damasceno…’

We went to do a conference in Latin America with a man called Cardinal Damasceno in the Catholic Church, and at the end of the conference he said, ‘Do you want to come to church with us at the weekend?’ So we went, thinking it’ll be a little church. We arrived at this church: there were 45,000 people in the service! 4,000 buses, 6,000 cars.

To show an image of the crowds at the World Youth Day in Rio, you can access images via a Google image search:World Youth Day Rio

In Rio last year, World Youth Day – this is a picture of the scene on the beach: three million young people worshipping Jesus, led by Pope Francis. The church is thriving.

United States: 92 per cent profess to believe in God. 250 million Christians. Africa: in 1900, 10 million people; by 2000, 360 million Christians: that’s a growth rate of 3,600 per cent. China: 1940, 4 million Christians; today, China experts reckon there are well over 100 million, and China may soon become the largest Christian country in the world.



https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=world+youth+day+rio&safe=active&client=safari&rls=en&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAWoVChMIvpOsheiFyQIVC_EUCh0Wwg_B&biw=1645&bih=908

Personalise or generalise the text in red.

Personalise, generalise or omit the text in red.


And it includes, of course, parts of the church where they’re persecuted. Again, I was so ignorant. I thought persecution of the church had died out when the Roman Empire stopped persecuting Christians. Nothing, again, could be further from the truth.

More people have died for their faith in Jesus Christ in the last 100 years than in all the other centuries put together. But by all accounts, even in those places the church is strong and vibrant. And it’s a huge privilege to be able to worship without being arrested, imprisoned, threatened, or even tortured and executed.

So we are the body of Christ. Paul said, ‘You are the body of Christ.’ So we don’t want to be divided. Tragically, the church has divided so much over the years. But the exciting thing, and this is what I’ve observed: we’ve been privileged to travel all round the world – is the Holy Spirit is doing a new thing. He’s bringing Christians together of all different churches. And people are recognising that we need one another; that the church is multifaceted, but it needs to be united.

And I have come to love so many different parts of the church. I love the Catholic Church – I’ve been so enriched by it. I love the Orthodox Church. I love the Pentecostal Church. I love the Salvation Army. I love— I mustn’t do this list, because I’ll miss someone out! But I love them all. I’ve been so enriched by the church. And we are one body.

And unity is so important. We need one another. I don’t have the whole truth! No one has the whole truth. It’s only together that we get a better view of the one who is the truth: Jesus is the truth. And we need one another. Unity and truth go hand in hand.

John 17:20–21 And Jesus prayed ‘that we may be one’ – we may be united – ‘in order that the world will believe’.




Because a divided world demands a united church. We’re supposed to set an example of unity. And unity is so powerful. It’s so beautiful. And I’m so excited to see that it’s happening. Because what unites us as Christians is infinitely greater than what divides us.

Unity doesn’t mean uniformity. Of course, there are lots of different parts, and variety is great. We can learn from one another. I used to think if a church was different, ‘Oh, they must be wrong!’ Now I think, ‘Wow, if they’re different, what can I learn from them?’ Paul says: ‘Consider others better than yourselves.’ And I think that’s a challenge, in a way. When we see another part of the church, let’s consider them better. ‘They’re doing things differently: they must be better.’ Maybe we can learn things from them.

So this united church where everyone has a part to play: everyone praying, everyone giving, everyone serving. And the church is the biggest volunteer organisation in the world: feeding the hungry, visiting people in hospital, serving people in prison, caring for ex-offenders, fighting injustice, fighting human trafficking – doing all these things.

Just one little tiny example of what the church does. I read this recently: that churches in the UK provide half of the toddler-and-parent groups, they have the biggest network of debt counsellors, and they will feed over 100,000 hungry people this year. That’s just one thing that they do. The church is Jesus. It’s his body to the world.

Talk Point 5LOVE


And the fifth word I want to pick is the most – well, it’s not the



most important, because they’re all important, but it’s a word which kind of sums up – Jesus sums up what this course is about, but this word also sums up what the whole course is about. It’s the word love.

Church is a kind of love affair. I love the church because Jesus loves the church. Jesus loves you. Paul writes this:

Ephesians 5:25,32 ‘Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her.’ And then he goes on to talk about marriage, but he says: ‘Actually I’m not really talking about marriage’; This is a profound mystery – but I am talking about Christ and the church.’

He says, ‘Look, marriage is not the be all and end all.’ Jesus never married. In a way, marriage is like a picture of something even more amazing and beautiful and profound: the relationship between Christ and the church.

Marriage is a great analogy. Marriage is like an institution, but if you take marriage as an analogy, if you just have marriage but no love, it’s kind of dead and dry. If you just have love but without marriage, it’s a bit unstable. If you bring together the love that two people have for each other, and the institution of marriage, then it is so powerful.

And it’s the same with the church. If you just have the institution of the church, it can be a bit dry. If you just have the love and fire of the Holy Spirit, the faith, it can be a bit unstable. But bring together the love, the fire, the enthusiasm and the institution of the church and it is so strong and so powerful!

Another reason marriage, I think, is a great analogy is because marriage is long-term. Alpha’s just the beginning. Alpha’s like the



wedding, maybe the honeymoon, but it’s not like the whole relationship. And what matters is the long term, the marriage.

Where are you going to be in your relationship with Jesus long term? Jesus loves you. He gave himself up for you. If you’d been the only person in the world, Jesus would have died for you. He loves you unconditionally, wholeheartedly, continually.

And we express our love for God in our worship and by what we do in our service. And the church – this is my dream for our little local church: that we should be famous for our love – a love that is radical, inclusive, unconditional, of people of different backgrounds, ages, ethnicities, lifestyles, perspectives.

The church is not a museum that displays these ‘perfect people’. It’s more like a hospital that welcomes the broken, the hurt, the wounded, and helps them to find healing. This unconditional love breaks down barriers. It puts people back on their feet. It restores and it heals.

S*This is a key story in that it illustrates the role of the church in showing love. Use this story, or replace it if you have another equally effective example.

If you use the Eddie story, you may obtain before an after pictures to show (corresponding to the text in red). See images copied at the bottom of this script.

I think of Eddie. This is what Eddie looked like when he came on the course. He was very sick. He had DVT in one leg and right knee, I think it was, and left ankle. He had cirrhosis of the liver. His lungs were failing. And he was close to death. He came on the course, he went on the Alpha Weekend, and someone prayed for him on the Alpha Weekend, and he encountered Jesus; he was filled with the Holy Spirit, and he was set free from all his addictions.

And this is what Eddie looks like now: that is Eddie, totally transformed by Jesus Christ. He’s a part of the church here. He’s an amazing guy. He’s like a full-time volunteer serving Jesus Christ in the church, free from drugs, free from his addictions, loving and serving Jesus Christ.



Amend the text in red if you didn’t not use the Eddie story. If possible, try to relate these points back to the story you used instead.

And that to me is a picture of what church is all about.

Being a Christian means belonging to the church. You don’t go to church – you are the church. You are friends of Jesus. Eddie had no friends; now, I consider it a real privilege to be a friend of Eddie. He has so many friends.

You are God’s family. Eddie had no family. He now has this amazing family who love him, his brothers and sisters in Christ.

Church is home. Eddie had no home. He had nowhere to live. Now, he has a home. He has a home – he has an actual physical flat to live in, but he also has a home in the church.

Church is Jesus. Eddie is out on Skid Row telling other people about Jesus. That’s what he does. His heart is filled with love for Jesus Christ. He represents Jesus wherever he goes!

And church is love. We’re the bride of Christ. Eddie has experienced this amazing love of Jesus. That’s what it’s all about. You are loved. You are loved by God. If you take nothing else away from this course, know that you are loved by God. Jesus died for you. You are a child of God. You have the Holy Spirit living within you. You have the most powerful message in the world. You can see people like Eddie having their lives transformed by Jesus Christ.

You can’t do it on your own.

Q Mother Teresa said this: ‘You can do what I cannot do. I can do what you cannot do. Together we can do great things.’

The Alpha Transcripts are taken from Alpha with Nicky Gumbel filmed 2014–2015, which are based on Questions of Life by Nicky Gumbel.

© Alpha International 2015



Prepared by: Alpha International, HTB Brompton Road, London SW7 1JA.Email: [email protected]: alpha.org

Acknowledgements:Scripture quotations taken from the Holy Bible,New International Version AnglicisedCopyright © 1979, 1984, 2011 Biblica, formerly International Bible SocietyUsed by permission of Hodder & Stoughton Publishers, an Hachette UK companyAll rights reserved‘NIV’ is a registered trademark of BiblicaUK trademark number 1448790.

Eddie McCormick, Before



mailto:[email protected]

Eddie McCormick, After





storage.snappages.site · Web view2020. 8. 8. · Eddie is out on Skid Row telling other people about Jesus. That’s what he does. His heart is filled with love for Jesus Christ.

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