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All rights reserved. No reproduction, copy or transmission of thispublication may be made without written permission.
No portion of this publication may be reproduced, copied or transmittedsave with written permission or in accordance with the provisions of theCopyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, or under the terms of any licencepermitting limited copying issued by the Copyright Licensing Agency,Saffron House, 6– 10 Kirby Street, London EC1N 8TS.
Any person who does any unauthorized act in relation to this publicationmay be liable to criminal prosecution and civil claims for damages.
The author has asserted his right to be identifi ed as the author of this work in accordance with the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988.
First published 2015 byPALGRAVE MACMILLAN
Palgrave Macmillan in the UK is an imprint of Macmillan Publishers Limited,registered in England, company number 785998, of Houndmills, Basingstoke,Hampshire RG21 6XS.
Palgrave Macmillan in the US is a division of St Martin’s Press LLC,175 Fifth Avenue, New York, NY 10010.
Palgrave Macmillan is the global academic imprint of the above companies and has companies and representatives throughout the world.
Palgrave® and Macmillan® are registered trademarks in the United States,the United Kingdom, Europe and other countries.
This book is printed on paper suitable for recycling and made from fullymanaged and sustained forest sources. Logging, pulping and manufacturingprocesses are expected to conform to the environmental regulations of thecountry of origin.
A catalogue record for this book is available from the British Library.
Library of Congress Cataloging-in-Publication DataTibbetts, John C.Those who made it : speaking with the legends of Hollywood / John C. Tibbetts.pages cmISBN 978–1–137–54190–1 (paperback)1. Motion picture industry—United States—History—20th century. 2. Motion picture producers and directors—United States—Interviews. 3. Cinematographers—United States—Interviews. I. Title. PN1993.5.U6T53 2015791.430973—dc23 2015019596
All rights reserved. No reproduction, copy or transmission of thispublication may be made without written permission.
No portion of this publication may be reproduced, copied or transmittedsave with written permission or in accordance with the provisions of theCopyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, or under the terms of any licencepermitting limited copying issued by the Copyright Licensing Agency,Saffron House, 6– 10 Kirby Street, London EC1N 8TS.
Any person who does any unauthorized act in relation to this publicationmay be liable to criminal prosecution and civil claims for damages.
The author has asserted his right to be identifi ed as the author of this work in accordance with the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988.
First published 2015 byPALGRAVE MACMILLAN
Palgrave Macmillan in the UK is an imprint of Macmillan Publishers Limited,registered in England, company number 785998, of Houndmills, Basingstoke,Hampshire RG21 6XS.
Palgrave Macmillan in the US is a division of St Martin’s Press LLC,175 Fifth Avenue, New York, NY 10010.
Palgrave Macmillan is the global academic imprint of the above companies and has companies and representatives throughout the world.
Palgrave® and Macmillan® are registered trademarks in the United States,the United Kingdom, Europe and other countries.
This book is printed on paper suitable for recycling and made from fullymanaged and sustained forest sources. Logging, pulping and manufacturingprocesses are expected to conform to the environmental regulations of thecountry of origin.
A catalogue record for this book is available from the British Library.
Library of Congress Cataloging-in-Publication DataTibbetts, John C.Those who made it : speaking with the legends of Hollywood / John C. Tibbetts.pages cmISBN 978–1–137–54190–1 (paperback)1. Motion picture industry—United States—History—20th century. 2. Motion picture producers and directors—United States—Interviews. 3. Cinematographers—United States—Interviews. I. Title. PN1993.5.U6T53 2015791.430973—dc23 2015019596
Typeset by MPS Limited, Chennai, India.
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vii
Contents
List of Figures ix
Foreword by David Thomson x
Acknowledgments xi
Introduction: Interviews and Conversations 1
1 Innovations in 1920s and 1930s Hollywood Cinematography, Sound Technology, and Feature- Length Animation 7Cinematographer Glen MacWilliams: “We were trained by trial and error!” 7Sound engineer Bernard B. Brown: “Now hear this!” 19Animator Ollie Johnston: “We are just actors with a pencil!” 25
2 Hollywood at Home and at War in the 1940s 34Producer John Houseman: “It was a great magic act!” 34Catherine Wyler and the crew of The Memphis Belle: “In the crossfire of history and fiction” 42
3 Cold War Film and Television in the 1950s 56Writer Ray Bradbury: “All my short stories can be shot right off the page!” 56Television showman “Buffalo Bob” Smith: “Fifty years later Howdy is still just ten years old!” 63Hollywood stuntman Richard Farnsworth: “The ground got too hard!” 70
4 “New Hollywood” Filmmakers in the 1970s and 1980s 82Director Robert Altman: “My films are not factual; they are truthful!” 82
(Additional remarks from set designer Stephen Altman) Director Steven Spielberg on The Color Purple: “I didn’t want to make another E.T.!” 92
(Additional remarks from actress Whoopi Goldberg) Cinematographer Allen Daviau: “Every film I do is a year out of my life!” 99Director Terry Gilliam: “I see things with cartoonist’s eyes!” 116Director Michael Moore: “I’m supposed to be making a Buick!” 123
(A dditional remarks from producer Wendey Stanzler) Producer Jim Henson: “Kermit is always here!” 132
(Additional remarks from production assistant Cheryl Henson)
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Special effects producer Richard Edlund: “You only see the stars from the dark side of the moon!” 137Film editor Neal Travis: “I’m creating a pattern!” 143
5 Late Twentieth Century Cultural Inclusion 154Director Bernardo Bertolucci: “Movies are my sand mandalas!” 154Director Wayne Wang: “Epic radiance!” 162Director Mira Nair: “I love to choreograph the chaos!” 167Director George Miller: “People understand car crashes in any language!” 171Composer Philip Glass: “Films become history quicker than any other art!” 178Film critic Roger Ebert: “Everybody’s a critic!” 188
6 Epilogue: Past is Prologue 197Film preservationist Kevin Brownlow: “I never expected to make my living at film preservation!” 197Composer Carl Davis: “Why don’t I try to score a complete silent film?” 200
Notes 209
Index 227
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1
Introduction: Interviews and Conversations
“We had good talk, sir!”— Samuel Johnson
The cover photo of this book depicts Steven Spielberg conferring with Whoopi Goldberg on the set of the director’s landmark classic, The Color Purple (1985). The film would not only have a profound impact on the career trajectories of both director and actor, but would mark a significant moment in the history of Classical Hollywood— from the 1920s to the wan-ing years of the last century— as will be seen in this and many other inter-views and conversations about films and filmmaking in this book.
Hollywood, as we have come to know it, seems always to have been around. Even back in the dusty nickelodeon days, before that “mystic com-motion” of flickering images became the big business of a global industry, we sensed its presence and its promise. Only the benefit of years of hind-sight, however, rather than the application of calipers and measuring sticks, can gain us any sense of its proper proportion. Similarly, only now, as I take the long view of my more than 40 years of interviews— a selection of which is collected in this volume— can I grasp the composite portrait of Hollywood it affords. I could echo the words of Otis Ferguson, written in 1940:
The movies were upon us before anyone had time to grow up and become a professor in them. They literally grew out of the people, the hundreds of thousands of people who jumped in to produce, distribute, exhibit, direct, write for, or act in a popular commodity.1
Thus, like Hollywood itself, Those Who Made It just sort of accumulated. Once inside these talks, I am now outside them. I can see that, taken together, they provide a kind of running oral commentary on the history of classical Hollywood. The result is not unlike the classic Grimm tale, “The Juniper Tree,” wherein those scattered bones hint at a deeper, collective shape and meaning.
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What was it like to work “behind the scenes,” away from the spotlight’s glare, in Hollywood’s so- called “Golden Age”? The complexity of the film industry involves a collective interchange among the directors, producers, cinematographers, writers, animators, editors, composers, stunt persons, critics, and, yes, historians and film preservationists. Differentiating their distinctive roles is, as always, a complicated endeavor. In its own modest way, the first- hand interviews and conversations in Those Who Made It pro-vide some sense of identification. Moreover, they consider crucial moments and developments in the speakers’ personal and professional experiences.2
These were the years spanning the dawn of sound to the expanded global reach of the new century, when the so- called “classical modes” of studio production, technological innovation, narrative paradigms, genre para-digms, and business practices were developed, standardized, and extended. Despite the many shocks to that system, including federally- imposed consent decrees, the competition of television, an evolving social con-sciousness, experiments in narrative strategies, and the rise of independent filmmakers and modes of distribution and exhibition, etc., it can (and has) been argued that classical Hollywood absorbed them all and prevailed. As Jean- Luc Godard noted in 1980, “Hollywood no longer exists in the same way, but it re- exists in another way.”3
This chorus of voices, is a diverse lot, to be sure. Moving from one to the other pin- wheels us off in many directions. But the “voice” that unifies them all is mine. I sought out these encounters myself, video camera and tape recorder in hand; with no apologies, I approached them with respect and affection. The soul of good conversation, after all, is sympathy. Except for a few opportunities in television studios and on Hollywood studio- organized junkets, most were done in the more intimate, casual confines of private homes, classrooms, back stage, even a few bars and watering holes. I have found that in the relative unreserve of such private discourse, as William Hazlitt has observed,
The subjects are more at liberty to say what they think, to put the subject in different and opposite points of view … to obviate misconception, to state difficulties on their own side of the argument, and answer them as well as they can.4
I took advantage of my privileged access as a former radio and television journalist for CBS television, pursued inside contacts in Hollywood as edi-tor of the National Film Society’s American Classic Screen, and deployed aca-demic connections as a Professor of Film at the University of Kansas. Finally, I found these people at specific moments in time. Some look back at their careers from the long end of history; while others are in the moment, reacting to the flux and change of their personal and professional lives.
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Introduction: Interviews and Conversations 3
At this point, readers of this book might well ask, Can we expect these artists to talk as well as they practice their craft? Judge for yourself.
Somewhat vexing is another question … are these talks interviews or conversations? There is a difference, although it is not easy to define. To my mind, some of the two- way exchanges in this book— most of which are published here in their complete state for the first time— encourage and enjoy the relative ease, give- and- take, and informality of a conversation. Others display the more formally interrogative agendas of an interview. If pressed to the wall, I would select as “interviews” my talks with cinema-tographer Allen Daviau, sound technician Bernard B. Brown, and special effects wizard Richard Edlund. They speak in almost clinical detail about, respectively, the collaborative process between cinematographer and director, the complexities of melding music and image, and the challenges of new digital effects technologies. By contrast, the conversations with critic Roger Ebert, veteran stuntman Richard Farnsworth, and maverick director Robert Altman are full of free- wheeling anecdotes and candid opinions. Somewhere in between are Terry Gilliam, Ray Bradbury, and Michael Moore who kick at the windmills of the Hollywood establishment.
Conversations … or interviews? Best take Yogi Berra’s advice: If you come to a fork in the road, “Take it!”
By the way, I have resisted the temptation to flesh them out into prose essays. I have left them in their original conversational form, exercising only a judicious use of punctuation and organizational clarity to ensure their readability on the page.
My subjects are grouped in a rough chronology spanning almost 80 years, decade by decade. Chapter One takes us back to the 1920s through the 1930s, when cinematographer Glen MacWilliams, sound technician Bernard B. Brown, and Disney animator Ollie Johnston introduced new technologies and approaches to their craft. MacWilliams recalls shooting silent westerns in the ‘teens, grappling with early talking picture technology in the late 1920s, photographing musical films in the 1930s, and working with Alfred Hitchcock on the classic Lifeboat. Brown takes us back to the soundstage of the landmark The Jazz Singer; Ollie Johnston reveals the collaborative efforts of Disney’s “Nine Old Men” in the making of those enduring masterpieces, Snow White, Pinocchio, Fantasia, Peter Pan, etc.
In Chapter Two, Hollywood takes to the skies to bring Second World War aerial combat to home front audiences with the classic documentary, Memphis Belle; and director Orson Welles collaborates with producer John Houseman to revolutionize film form and expression in the groundbreaking Citizen Kane. Producer Catherine Wyler and reunited crew members of the titular B- 17 bomber debate the facts and the fictions of the film. And pro-ducer John Houseman wryly recalls the difficulties of working with Welles on stage and screen.
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4 Those Who Made It
Chapter Three examines the Cold War in the 1950s and 1960s through the lenses of science fiction movies, action pictures, and the newly emerging medium of commercial television. Ray Bradbury, in 1990, on the occasion of his 50th anniversary as a professional writer, recounts his struggles to bring his fantastic visions to movies and television. Television producer “Buffalo Bob” Smith and his puppet “Howdy Doody” bring “live” children’s enter-tainment into the home. Finally, veteran stuntman Richard Farnsworth recounts the thrills and hazards of a career that spanned four decades, from top stuntman to featured player in a series of revisionist westerns.
Chapter Four traces new directions in1970s and 1980s Hollywood in narrative and documentary structures, social themes, children’s entertain-ment, and special effects, as represented by conversations and interviews with Robert Altman, Steven Spielberg, Allen Daviau, Terry Gilliam, Michael Moore, Jim Henson, Richard Edlund, and Neal Travis. Robert Altman was the standard bearer of the so- called “Hollywood Renaissance” that brought a newly personalized and idiosyncratic attitude to filmmaking. In 1991 he looks back on his career and anticipates future film projects as he revisits his roots in his home town of Kansas City.
Steven Spielberg and his cameraman, Allen Daviau, worked together dur-ing the formative years of Spielberg’s career in the 1980s. Here they talk in 1985 about their work on the newly released The Color Purple, the film that marked new directions in Spielberg’s growing sensitivity to the African- American experience in America. (A brief note brings Whoopi Goldberg into the conversation.)
As one of the screen’s Bad Boys, former Monty Python regular Terry Gilliam waxes wroth in 1985 about the censorship and studio interference dogging the release of Brazil.
Indisputably America’s master cinematic provocateur, Michael Moore is just starting out on his career in 1989 as he anticipates the release of his breakout film, Roger & Me.
In 1986 the creator of the Muppets, Jim Henson, talks about his life and work on the occasion of the release of the film Labyrinth, which took his Muppets into new, more dramatic directions (Kermit makes a special guest appearance).
Richard Edlund is the dean of special- effects wizards, and when we met in 1984 he hailed the digital innovations of the newly released 2010, a sequel to 2001: A Space Odyssey. Lastly, film editor Neal Travis had just completed editing of Patriot Games when he sat down with me in 1992 to talk about editing in general and, in particular, his work with first- time director Kevin Costner on Dances with Wolves.
Chapter Five traces the years leading up to the new century as Hollywood adopts a new cultural and ethnic inclusiveness. The Italian master Bernardo Bertolucci is heard in two interviews, in 1987 and 1994; and he shares his
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Introduction: Interviews and Conversations 5
experiences in filming The Last Emperor in the Forbidden City in China and Little Buddha in India. He concludes his remarks with a touching valedic-tory to Federico Fellini, who had just passed away at the time of the latter interview.
Hong Kong- born and American educated, Wayne Wang has brought to the American cinema a distinctly Chinese- American subject and sensibility. Here he is in 1993 on the occasion of the release of his most commercially successful film, The Joy Luck Club.
Mira Nair brought her Indian heritage and sensibility to Hollywood in 1988 with the first of her acclaimed films, Salaam Bombay! Here, on the threshold of her career, she shares the challenges of her multi- ethnic vision.
George Miller was one of the leaders of the Australian New Wave in the late 1970s and 1980s, as he and others of his generation— Peter Weir, Bruce Beresford, and Gillian Armstrong— brought Australian history, land-scape, and vernacular to American audiences. Here he is, in July 1983, on the occasion of the release of The Road Warrior, the second of his “Mad Max” trilogy.
Philip Glass is a “ cross- over” composer, successfully bridging classical and popular modes and venues in the concert hall and in his film scores. We find him here in 1987 as he works on the Koyaanisqat trilogy for Godfrey Reggio.
Surveying it all is critic Roger Ebert. Speaking from his Chicago home in October 1991, he reassesses the practices and agendas of his work as a film critic, and, on a more personal level, anticipates his impending marriage to Chaz Hammel- Smith.
Chapter Six serves as an Epilogue. With the new century, classical Hollywood seems to retreat into its own past, indulging in a succession of memorabilia auctions and museum displays; congratulating itself in endless awards ceremonies, nostalgia channels and celebrity cruises; and recycling its own past in endless sequels, reboots and retreads. Its once- glorious vision threatens to be reduced to the size of hand- held mobile devices. At the same time, thankfully, the last three decades have also seen an emerging generation of film preservationists working worldwide to honor and restore, not exploit, our film heritage.
Speaking from their homes in London, in 1995, film historian/preserva-tionist Kevin Brownlow and composer Carl Davis collaborate on restoring the glory days of the film past to new audiences and new venues. Past is prologue. We end where we began.
I invite you to tilt your ear closely to these pages. And listen. You might well fancy that you hear the voices. Imagine, if you will, the warmly fluid cadences of “down under” Australian George Miller; the soft, slow, halting whisper of Richard Farnsworth; the insistent, rapid- fire barrages of Terry
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Gilliam; the measured, “cultivated” cadences of John Houseman; the gruff growls of Allen Daviau; the flattened Midwestern drawl of Robert Altman; the clipped speech inflections of the Indian- born Mira Nair; and the rhyth-mic flourishes of the Italian Bernardo Bertolucci, etc. Their accents and dic-tion may vary; but their lingua franca is the cinema itself.
I invite you to read on … and, in a very real sense, lend an ear …
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227
NOTE: Unless otherwise indicated, all italicized titles designate motion pictures
Acting Company, 34, see Houseman, JohnAir Force, 213chap2n16
and Calvin Films, 84– 85and Hollywood Renaissance, 82– 83and Kansas City, 82– 83, 89– 90and television, 83, 85filmmaking techniques, 85– 86, 87– 88,
90, 91, 92on films, Brewster McCloud, 83
on Come Back to the 5 and Dime, 83on Long Goodbye, 86on M*A*S*H, 83on McCabe & Mrs. Miller, 83, 86on Popeye, 83on Rossini, Rossini, 91– 92on Shortcuts, 91on Tanner’ 88, 83, 91, 218chap4n11on Vincent and Theo, 86– 89
student workshop, 89– 90Altman, Stephen, 87
as set designer, 87– 89, 90, 217chap4n1comments on father, 90
Amblin, 100See Daviau, Allen
American Classic Screen magazine, 2, 209chap1n2, 211chap1n28
Animation, see Disney, WaltArliss, George, 22Armstrong, Gillian, 5, 172Association of Moving Image Archivists
(AMIA), 225chap6n6Australian New Wave, 224chap5n22– 25
see also Miller, George
Babbitt, Art, 29See Johnston, Ollie
Bad and the Beautiful, The, see Houseman, John
Bambi, see Johnston, OllieBeresford, Bruce, 5, 172Barhydt, Frank, 85
on Robert Altman, 217chap4n5Bertolucci, Bernardo, 154
early years, 160on Buddhism, 158– 159on China’s Cultural Revolution, 154,
156– 157on death of Federico Fellini, 162on Forbidden City, 157, 222chap5n6on films
on Technicolor, 109– 110on theater exhibition quality control,
100– 101, 115– 116Davis, Carl, 5, 197
as collaborator with Kevin Brownlow, 199– 200, 202– 203
on affective properties in music,on American citizenship, 201– 202
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Index 229
on composing for silent films, 202, 203, 205, 208
on composing for sound films, 200, 202
on filmsCity Lights, 205Flesh and the Devil, 205French Lieutenant’s Woman,
206– 207The General, 205Greed, 205– 206Hollywood television series, 202Napoleon, 201, 203– 204, 207on Rainbow, The, 207The Wind, 205on World at War, The, 202
Greed, see Davis, CarlGrey Fox, The, 70, 216chap3n25
see Farnsworth, Richard
Halloween Tree, Thesee Bradbury, Ray
Hammel- Smith, Chaz, see Ebert, ChazHammond, Percy, 36Harryhausen, Ray, 56, 139, 220chap4n37Hazlitt, William, 2, 209intron4He Comes Up Smiling, see MacWilliams,
GlenHell’s Angels, see MacWilliams, GlenHenson, Jim, 4, 82, 132
creator of Muppets, 132– 133Creature Shop, Thedeath of, 220chap4n32on films,
Dark Crystal, 134, 136Labyrinth, 134– 136Muppet Show, The, 132Muppets Take Manhattan, The, 136Storyteller, The, 132Wizard of Oz, The, 134
on Disney, Walt, 133on family life, 134on Kermit the Frog, 133– 134, 136on Sendak, Maurice, 134sale of company to Walt Disney
Company, 220chap4n32Henson, Cheryl, 134
family life, 134, 136– 137on Labyrinth, 137
Herrmann, Bernard, 191His Majesty the American (book), 15Hitchcock, Alfred, 7
on character animation, 26– 27on Disney, Roy, 28on Disney Animation (book), 26, 32on Donald Duck, 30on Mickey Mouse, 26, 27, 29on “The Nine Old Men,” 31– 32,
211chap1n24Babbitt, Art, 29Kahl, Milt 29, 32Kimball, Ward 29, 30, 32Moore, Fred 26, 29, 32Reitherman, Woolie 29, 32Thomas, Frank 26, 29– 32, 33Tytla, Bill 29, 30
on Stokowski, Leopold, 28Disney, Walt, impressions of, 28, 30
Jones, Chuck, (see Bradbury, Ray)Jones, Quincy, see Spielberg, StevenJoy Luck Club, The, 5, 163
Smith, Roger, see Moore, MichaelSnow White, 3, see Johnston, OllieSomething Wicked This Way Comes (book
and movie), see Bradbury, RaySorceror’s Apprentice, see Bradbury, RaySpecial photographic effects, see Edlund,
RichardSpider’s Stratagem, 154
see Bertolucci, BernardoSpielberg, Steven, 1, 4, 82, 92, 100
and Daviau, Allen, see Daviau, Allenearly career, 92– 93on films
Back to the Future, 96Close Encounters, 94Color Purple, The, 93– 98E.T, 96Jaws, 96Peter Pan, 94Raiders of the Lost Ark, 93Schindler’s List, 93, 95– 96,