8/14/2019 Meet the Press, November 23, 2008 http://slidepdf.com/reader/full/meet-the-press-november-23-2008 1/36 Meet the Press, NBC November 23, 2008 MR. TOM BROKAW: Our issues this Sunday: After another down week of terrifying news in the financial markets, President-elect Obama unveils a massive new plan to stimulate the economy. He is expected to name the current head of the New York Fed, Tim Geithner, as his new secretary of the Treasury. What can be done now, and how will the president-elect address this continuing economic meltdown come January? Insights from two political heavyweights--a man who served President Reagan as secretary of the Treasury and George Bush 41 as secretary of state, Jim Baker; and an adviser to Obama's transition team, the secretary of commerce for President Bill Clinton, William Daley of Chicago. Then, he was the Democratic vice presidential nominee in 2000 but supported Republican John McCain in 2008. After a fight to keep his key chairmanship in the Senate, does Joe Lieberman have any regrets? We'll ask him. An exclusive interview with Connecticut's independent senator, Joe Lieberman. Plus: (Videotape) REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA): ...they show us the plan, we cannot show them the money. (End videotape) MR. BROKAW: Prospects for a Detroit bailout fade on Capitol Hill. The very latest on the Obama transition and his expected Cabinet picks. Insights and
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MR. BROKAW: We're beginning to hear some of the details this morning. Is
this going to be an FDR public works kind of project?
MR. WILLIAM DALEY: I think what you're going to see, Tom, is a combination
of, yes, there must be infrastructure, we must rebuild our roads, our
bridges, as the president-elect said. We must modernize our schools. Those
are investments. But at the same time, there'll be a host of other things that
the economic team will look at. The president-elect is intent on this being
done over the next number of weeks, ready to be introduced even before
he's sworn in so that the Congress can deal with it over those three--two
and a half weeks and then hopefully pass it and have it ready to be signed.
But it will be large enough to be meaningful and will hopefully set a
predicate for laying a stronger economy, so then he can deal with the longer
term issues that have been neglected for so long, starting in hopefully '10
and '11.
MR. BROKAW: We're going to get to Detroit in a moment, but will he also be
addressing manufacturing in states like Ohio, and the issues of trade, whichwere so contentious during the campaign?
MR. DALEY: I think you'll see, in this economic recovery legislation, across-
the-board look at what, what needs to be done; how large must this action
be to really make an impact in the two years to create those or save those
two and a half million jobs. It has to be a very large package, but it has to
be a combination of things, tax cuts, the president-elect has been intent ontrying to bring tax relief to the vast majority of the middle class in America.
MR. BROKAW: We want to get to taxes in a moment, but first, let's get the
reaction, if we can, of Secretary Baker who's in Texas this morning. Do you
MR. DALEY: That looks more likely than not, Tom, but the president-elect is
very committed to the fact that there must be greater equity in, in the
responsibility of, of taxes in this country. We must bring tax relief to the
middle class. He has said this now for two years as he's been out there on
the campaign, and he's going to deliver on that. That's an integral part of his
economic recovery package next year is to bring some tax relief to the
American people and the vast majority who are in the middle class, not
those of us who do much better than that. So I, I think he's going, he's, he's
got a great team he's putting together: Tim Geithner, Larry Summers, a
whole host of other people, that he's charged with putting this plan together.
I think he's gone out to get the most competent, qualified, experienced
people to put this together. We are, as Secretary Baker said, in the middle of
an unprecedented economic crisis. We will come out of it, but these are
times that no one's ever seen, and it's a global issue. And of all the people
he's put forward in these major jobs are very experienced in a global setting
of economics also.
MR. BROKAW: And, Secretary Baker, keeping the Bush tax cuts in place, willthat be central to winning any Republican support for a massive public
stimulus program of some kind?
MR. BAKER: Well, it depends on which you mean by keeping them in place.
If that means he's not going to try to repeal, not going to try to increase
taxes during this very critical next two-year period, then, yes, it would be
and probably would be if it means that he's going to abandon the idea of, of keeping them, keeping taxes low thereafter. But let me, let me second what,
what Secretary Daley said about the team that the president-elect is putting
together. I think he's appointed some extraordinarily capable people, and
we're going to see some more, as I understand it. And I think he's to be
I, I agree with Secretary Baker that confidence is what's lacking. Senator
Obama, in his address yesterday, put forward a very positive program. He is
appreciative of President Bush's consultations with him, and they will
continue that. No question, this 60-day period is, in, in some ways, is an
opportunity to get a team together, get a plan together to act. We only have
one president during that period, but there is great consultation going on.
And, and, and all the major decisions that this, this administration is moving
on, they are consulting. And as President-elect Obama's team gets put
together, starting tomorrow, they'll be a greater opportunity for--to work
even closer.
MR. BROKAW: You've walked all the way around the simple question,
however.
MR. DALEY: Yeah.
MR. BROKAW: Secretary Baker...
MR. BAKER: Tom, Tom, I agree.
MR. BROKAW: Anyway, secretary...
MR. BAKER: I agree. I agree 100 percent. We can only have one president at
a time, but nothing would do more to create confidence and, and eliminate
the fear and anxiety that's out there, particularly in the finance--in financialmarkets, than to see the incoming president and the outgoing president get
together on a--on some sort of a proposal or, or program over the short
term. I'm not talking about the, the mid, the mid-term or, or long-term
correction of the economy, but something that would do a little more
perhaps to make sure that our, that our banks don't continue to slide down
and, and that would stabilize our financial system, which is critical.
MR. BROKAW: So if the--President-elect Obama came to you and said, "Bill,
what do you think? Should I go meet at the White House if we have sherpas
in advance work something out?" Do you think that that's a...
MR. DALEY: I, I, I don't think there's a, a meeting that's going to give the
confidence that Jim is talking about. I think what's going to take place is
you're going to have the confidence by the actions of this administration in
consultation with the president-elect, in--and then President-elect Obama, as
he has done, telling his team, "Quickly, in 60 days, put together a plan thatwe can pass, even before I become president." That's the sort of aggressive
leadership that I think President Obama's going to give. And I think the
markets, as shown by Friday's action, maybe, indicate that there is some
belief that, as his team gets appointed and they then develop a plan, that
we're going to begin to see some confidence come back into the--and there,
this is a difficult period, no doubt about it, in this transition period, but the
administration is also, as I understand it from press reports, moving veryquickly to possibly even change the plans that they've put forward at this
point.
MR. BAKER: The appointment...
MR. BROKAW: Here, here is part of the problem as I see it.
MR. BAKER: The appointment of the team...
MR. BROKAW: Go ahead.
MR. BAKER: Tom, the appointment of the team did, the appointment of the
team did, did stabilize things for a day or so, and Bill's quite right about that.
today is suggesting that Tim Geithner be moved up as the secretary of
Treasury, that he be put in place before the inauguration on January 20th. Is
that the kind of thing that the Obama team is going to explore?
MR. DALEY: Well, I, I, I think we're going to stick to the schedule, as has
been laid out, and that is the secretary of the Treasury will be nominated. He
has to go through a confirmation process. No one takes for granted the
Senate's action in that. But, but I think what Secretary Paulson said was
there are, there are tools they have today to prevent that sort of collapse,
and hopefully they will take them if they're faced with that. But these are
unprecedented times, no question about it. I don't think anyone's ever seen
them. It took us a long time to get to this. It's going to take us a long time
to get out of it. And we've just got to be confident that we have the tools
which Secretary Paulson said we do as a government, and then how to build
on those in this new administration.
MR. BROKAW: Detroit and what to do about it has been a central part of the
discussion in the past week, not just in Washington, but across the country.Will President-elect Obama address Detroit tomorrow on what he thinks
ought to be done about that?
MR. DALEY: I, I think at his press conference, I'm sure they'll--one of your
colleagues will ask the questions. He has been very up-front in saying, and
strong in saying that the auto industry is an important part of our economy.
This is an unprecedented time of difficulty. Much of the difficulty in our autoindustry brought on by the industry itself, but much also brought on by this
confluence of economic problems that have hit the country at once. There's
no question there is no desire for a bailout. That's not going to work. They
have been charged by the Congress, after failure last week, to come back to
that's the kind of approach, I think, that most Republicans would like to see
to the problems of Detroit.
MR. BROKAW: But then they lost their way, and a lot of people blame this
administration and others for always pushing back when people wanted to
raise the CAFE standards on mileage and not saying anything about Detroit
and its great binge when it came to SUVs and big gas-guzzling vehicles of all
kind. So...
MR. BAKER: Well, that's part of--of course, that's a big part of the problem.
But another large part of the problem is that they're simply not competitive.
Given the pension benefit obligations that they've incurred over the years
under both Republican and Democratic administrations, and given the, the
wage rates and salaries that they pay, I mean, other automobile companies
come into this country, they locate in the South or the West and they build
cars and they build them very effectively and very competitively. I think it
costs maybe--I think Detroit has to find $2,000 to compete with some of the
cars of--similar type car that Toyota builds in some of its plants in the South.
So that, that problem is endemic, and it's going to have to be addressed.
MR. BROKAW: Secretary Baker, I can't let you go without getting your
reaction, as a former secretary of state, to the prospect that Hillary Clinton
is going to be the new secretary of state in the--in an Obama administration.
What do you think of the choice of Hillary Clinton?
MR. BAKER: Well, well, as I said earlier, I think all of the choices that havebeen surfaced out there so far are, are quite good. I, I see them as--maybe
I'm wrong in this, I hope I'm not, but I see them as being sort of center-
right of the Democratic Party. With respect to Senator Clinton, she's got the
qualifications. She's extraordinarily intelligent. she is--her appointment,
did is as an Independent Democrat for somebody I had worked with very
closely. They expressed their disapproval of some of the things I said. I
accept that. That was the spirit of reconciliation. And now we move on
together to get the nation's business done.
MR. BROKAW: Have...
SEN. LIEBERMAN: Urgently.
MR. BROKAW: Have you picked up the phone and talked to Barack Obama
about just that?
SEN. LIEBERMAN: I, I called Senator Obama, President-elect Obama, after
the campaign. He's busy. I heard back from Joe Biden and Rahm Emanuel.
I'm sure, in time, Senator Obama and I, who, who, who have developed a
good friendship and working relationship over the years he's been in the
Senate, will, will talk. In some sense he talked to me through Harry Reid and
his spokespeople, and I appreciate very much the spirit of reconciliation thathe evoked. We don't have the luxury of looking backward to the campaign.
He's the winner. He's the president-elect. We've all got to work together with
him to make him successful, and that's what I'm committed to doing.
MR. BROKAW: I hear the word regret but not the word apology.
SEN. LIEBERMAN: Well, I do, I regret it. I mean, I don't, I, I, you know, I'm
going forward. You can take from the word regret what you, what you, will. Iwish I had not said some of the things I've said. But, again, we all do it.
There was a lot of stuff said in this campaign about both candidates that I
think a lot of people regret. I'm happy to step forward and say that I regret
some of the things I've said. But somebody once said to me, God put our
MR. BROKAW: OK. The very latest on the prospects for a bailout of Detroit.
Also President-elect Obama's expected Cabinet picks and his big economic
stimulus program. Our political roundtable will be weighing in. Erin Burnett,
Paul Ingrassia, Eugene Robinson and Chuck Todd next only here on MEET
THE PRESS.
(Announcements)
MR. BROKAW: We're back. We've got lots to talk about this morning with
Erin Burnett of CNBC; Paul Ingrassia, the former Detroit bureau chief for The
Wall Street Journal; Gene Robinson of The Washington Post; and Chuck
Todd, political director of NBC News. Welcome to all of you.
Erin, you've been around the world and back in the last 10 days or so. You
were in Moscow, you've been talking to Hank Paulson and other people. Of
course you've been keeping track of the markets nanosecond by nanosecond
because that's what's required today. What do you think the response will
be, and I always hate that amorphous term, of the markets tomorrow to thisannouncement that Barack Obama plans a two and a half million job
economic stimulus program of some kind?
MS. ERIN BURNETT: It's so hard to tell what the market will do, you're right,
nanosecond by nanosecond, but if you take Friday as an indication to
Timothy Geithner as head of the Treasury, obviously that did cause a last
minute surge, and it broke a couple of bad days for the market. So you couldsay that might be an indication the market would take it positively. Two and
a half million jobs, though, really isn't that many. That would still leave you
with a net loss next year, and many people might say OK, that's good, but
not overly ambitious, particularly those on Wall Street who are lukewarm on
the idea of a massive infrastructure project. So maybe it indicates he's being
a little cautious on the infrastructure side, and that would be received
warmly.
MR. BROKAW: Isn't the more critical need to do something about Citibank
and the other financial institutions that are in free fall?
MS. BURNETT: Citibank is an incredible story. And some reports that I've
heard is that the vast majority of trading last week was people betting the
stock would go down. You look at the cash position of Citigroup, it may be
too big to manage, it may be a company with a lot of problems, all of that is
true, but that company has $800 billion in deposits. There has been no fear,
no fleeing, and to see that institution go down so quickly is truly shocking
and, as you said, would be shocking to the Treasury secretary as well.
MR. BROKAW: Chuck Todd, we heard former Secretary of the Treasury Jim
Baker, former secretary of state, a wise man in the Republican Party,
announce today that he thinks that Barack Obama and President Bushshould get together before the inauguration with some kind of a symbolic act
to try to shore up confidence in this country.
MR. CHUCK TODD: Well, it's interesting, and, and what I'll be curious to see
is what Republicans will jump on that bandwagon and say let's do
something. And maybe the symbolic act is what you asked him about in
particular, asked Bill Daley about it, about getting Timothy Geithner in placenow. You know, don't wait until January 20th. What's been interesting about
watching Barack Obama during this transition is he wanted to hold off on, on
MS. BURNETT: But, Tom, there's also this whether Tim Geithner should take
over. There are real differences between Henry Paulson and Tim Geithner.
MR. BROKAW: Right.
MS. BURNETT: And one of the biggest questions out there, when you talk
about Citigroup, what are we going to use the rest of this TARP money for?
Hank Paulson's trying to wait and leave that for the next administration. So
if you did have Tim Geithner come in, he could say, "This is how I want to
spend it. This is what I want to use it for." And that would give some clarity
that might be needed.
MR. BROKAW: In the meantime, the 100,000-pound gorilla in Washington
and across the country is your area of expertise, Paul Ingrassia. We're going
to show on the screen a letter that Harry Reid, the Senate majority leader,
and Nancy Pelosi, the speaker of the House, have sent to Detroit, saying
really, "You've got to get your house in order. We'll help if you can guaranteeus that you'll make the kinds of changes" that required everything from
executive pay to reorganization. What do you think the chances are that
something will be done before January 20th on behalf of Detroit with pretty
strict conditions that are short of formal bankruptcy?
MR. PAUL INGRASSIA: Well, you know, we hear a lot about hybrid cars, Tom,
and I think what we probably need in a case like this is something thatmight be called hybrid bankruptcy. Or if that word is toxic, let's call it hybrid
restructuring. You need someone that has the authority to really cut through
some of the ropes that are tied around this industry that really prevent it
from being competitive and effective. The dealer franchise laws basically
going to see this Democratic-controlled Congress or Barack Obama let the
car companies go under, let any one of them go under because there is
enormous pressure being put on them by labor beyond what we've seen.
And that's why you do wonder if, if Congress should put them up and say,
you know, "You've got to publicly be a part of this solution," and put them up
with the executives. And that's something they haven't done. We'll see. I, I,
I think that, that there is a majority out there to save, to save the auto.
MR. BROKAW: Maybe that plan is what President Bush and President-elect
Obama, under the Baker proposal, should be working on between now and
January 20th.
MR. INGRASSIA: Well, that would be exhibit A in my book. I mean, I really
think, you know, I agree absolutely with what Chuck said about the union
pressure. I think, think the union's got to come to the party on this. I mean,
even today, Tom, some of the Big Three car factories have to staff 20
percent above the staffing level that it would take to normally operate the
plant because of absenteeism. I mean, you know, a simpler operating
contract, the, the contract that they have out in California at the GM/Toyota joint venture, you just miss a certain number of days and you're out. There's
no negotiating with bureaucracies about, well, is this an excused absence or
not an excused absence? It's a simpler operating agreement. And the
template already exists. They should take the corporate jets and go to
California and find it.
MS. BURNETT: We need more clarity, though, on where these two and a half million jobs are going to come from because, as I say, I think that's a lot less
than a lot of people on Wall Street were expecting to hear out of Obama,
maybe a larger number. But if you're going to talk about restructuring here,
you're going to lose jobs no matter what. And finding some sort of an
immediate transition seems to be very important. And if you're talking about
infrastructure, there's only about $18 billion of projects ready to go that you
could really put people to work on. So there is this sort of no man's land that
we're going to go into where you could have a lot of people looking for work
in addition to where we are right now and not really having anywhere to go
right, right yet.
MR. BROKAW: Yeah, I've told--I've been told by governors and mayors alike
that it's about an 18-month ramp-up to any kind of realistic public works
program. We're going to talk about the Cabinet that is now beginning to
take shape. The one that has been getting the most attention besides Tim
Geithner as the choice of the secretary of the Treasury, as you might expect,
Madam Secretary of State, Hillary Clinton. The Clintonistas are back--Rahm
Emanuel as the White House chief of staff, Eric Holder, the attorney general.
What are the issues for Hillary Clinton beyond Bill? Or are those the big
issues?
MR. TODD: Oh, I think it was the--that Bill was the big issue here. In fact,
there were some very loyal Hillary loyalists very upset this week, thinkingthat Bill and his boys were, were, were messing the whole deal up by leaking
the fact of how cooperative he was being. It was creating this--the drama
that the Obama folks were trying to avoid. And it was my understanding that
some, some Hillary loyalists made it clear to Chicago, this isn't us. This isn't
the way we're going to be. We're not going to be this type of State
Department. I think what's critical going forward is what is the relationship
going to be with Jim Jones...
MR. BROKAW: Yes.
MR. TODD: ...who's the likely national security adviser and Hillary Clinton?