- SPECIAL REPORTS + MAHARASHTRA - INTERVIEWIBAL THACKERAY I "Yes, I'm the remote control" NOTHING in his life has affectedShivSena chief Bal Thackeray, 69, asmuchas the re- cent death of his wije Meenatai, whom he used to address as "Ma". So much so, that a man whom Maharashtra Chief Minister Manohar Joshi and other followers de- scribe as 'Hindu Hriday Samrat' has now turnedan agnostic. But even after discard- ing his rudrakshmalas and removingpic- tures and idols of Ganeshfrom his house, Thackeray has not forsaken his identity as a belligerent Hindu leader Surrounded by images of his wije, the Sena leader spoke to Senior Associate Editor M. RAHMAN about his hold over the Maharashtra Govern- ment, the rise of his son and nephew, rela- tions with the BJP, swadeshi and other issues. Excerpts from the interview: Q. Will the Shiv Sena-BJP Govern- ment survive thefull term? A. Yes, I'm quite sure about that. What they (the Congress-I) are doing is scaremongering, largely because of the court cases involving Manohar Joshi and four or five others. But no matter what happens, there is no danger to us because even if our number in the As- sembly gets reduced, there are around 17 to 20 independent MLAs who are completelywith us. Q. But doubts have also arisen because of your warning to inde- pendent MLAs to stop "anti-government ac- tivities ". A. I warned two or three of them, not all independents. It is like this-when I say something about Bangladeshis, Bangla Muslims, Jyoti Basu al- ways feels that I'm againstBengalis. That is the mistake they are re- peating here. Q. Do you think ManoharJoshi will last afull term? A. He's doing very well. He's a very enthusiastic person, why should I disturb him unless something happens? There are two or three people who are also competent, but he's definitely more competent. Q. But you keep pulling him up publicly. A. As far as the Government's poli- 'Even if Joshi is the chief minister, he has to consult me as far as the Government's policiesare concerned.' cies are concerned, even if he's the chief minister, he has to consult me. That he also knows. The airport MOU he signed with the Hindujas, for instance. My problem is that my people are poor, their immediate need is not an airport. Hous- ing, food and water are the priorities. Q. So you hold the remote control i n your hand? A. Yes, I am the remote control. Re- mote controls are the latest develop- ment in science. When the Congress was in power, nobody criticisedthe way Sharad Pawar would be summoned by the high command in Delhi. So why at- tackmy remote control. Remote control must be there because it is a Shiv Sena andnjp government,and we will control it from bothsides.Thechief ministerhas certain rights, like changing officials and bureaucrats, but when it comes to policies,if something goes wrong, I'llbe heldresponsible. Q. Even appointments like that of the commissioner of Bombay Police are decided by you. A. I can make suggestions. I've also studiedthe city,soto saveMumbaiIhave theright to say who is the right man tobe police commissioner. Q. In your paper Saamna you've strongly criticised bu- reaucrats. A. I'm definitely blunt about my thoughts. I will not tol- erate any bureaucrat who's pro-Pawar. If I come to know that any official is pro-Pawar, 1'11 see to it that he's kicked out. Bureaucrats should not play politics. Q. The Sena and BP are also having prob- lems i n the coalition. A. That phase is over now. A.But youcriticisedthe BJP over the Kashmirpolls issue. A. On Kashmir, they opposed elec- tions,but also said if electionstake place they'll take part in it. If you ask me, 1'11 say,no electionstill theKashmiiiPandits can go back and cast their votes. That's why I said the BJP is trying to eat sugar and chillies together. Q. How would you deal with the Kashmir issue? A. We should give the army a free hand. Now it's like giving them Sten guns without bullets. Pakistani extrem- ists have encroached upon our land, andit is our right to retaliate and protect our sovereign state. Shoot them, kill them. No dialogue, not even withYasin Malilt. People must feel the pinch that there is a government. Or we are help- less, raped by everybody. We have a prime minister, we have a home minis- ter, so why shouldwe move like orphans without parents? Q. You also called swadeshi "rubbish ". A. Swadeshi must also have quality, not just quantity.You can't make rubber chappals with cardboard inside. First think of the product, then quality and then quantity. If you stretch the swadeshi idea too far, then you'll have to live in darkness, because the INIIIA TODAY OECEMBLK 15.1995