DETECTIVE GESCARD ISNORA, appearing as a witness, on his ...

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G.N. 2200

DETECTIVE GESCARD ISNORA,appearing as a witness, on his own behalf,

accompanied by his attorney, Phillip Karasyk, was questioned as follows:BY MR. REESE:

Q. Can you just state your full name for the record? A. First name Gescard, last name Isnora. Q. I would like to show you a document entitled

Waiver of Immunity. It's deemed Grand Jury Exhibit 60 for identification. You will be requested to swear to this waiver before testifying and giving evidence. You have the right to confer with your lawyer before deciding whether you will comply with that request. If you wish to consult with your lawyer, you will be given a reasonable time in which to do so. Do you have a lawyer?

A. Yes. Q. What is your lawyer's name? A. Phillip Karasyk. Q. Have you consulted with Mr. Karasyk about

executing that Waiver of Immunity, Exhibit 60 for identification?

A. Yes. Q. Is your lawyer, Mr. Karasyk, actually present in

this room with you at this time?

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G.N. 2201

A. Yes. Q. Has Mr. Karasyk explained to you what it means

for you to swear to this document? A. Yes. Q. Have you read that document, Grand Jury

Exhibit 60 for identification? A. I have. Q. Do you acknowledge that you have read it, that

you understand it and that the statements you made in it are true?

A. Yes. Q. Have you signed the document? A. Yes. Q. Do you understand that once you execute that

waiver anything you say can be used against you? A. Yes. Q. Can you please stand and face the foreperson and

raise your right hand? FOREPERSON: Do you, Gescard Isnora,

solemnly swear that you have read the document Waiver of Immunity and that you understand it?

MR. ISNORA: Yes. FOREPERSON: Do you further swear that you

have signed and executed the waiver and that the statements you have made in it are true?

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G.N. 2202

MR. ISNORA: Yes. MR. REESE: I ask the foreman to please sign

Grand Jury Exhibit 60 for ID. Thank you very much, and seeing both the

signature of the foreman and the signature of Gescard Isnora, I now move into evidence what was previously deemed marked as Grand Jury Exhibit 60 for ID into evidence as Grand Jury 60 in evidence and I am going to read the document. It's entitled Waiver of Immunity before the Grand Jury under Grand Jury number 1 of 2007. The caption is Investigation into the Death of Sean Bell and the Wounding of Joseph Guzman and Trent Benefield. It reads as follows: I, Gescard Isnora, employed at One Police Plaza, being a person about to become a witness in the above captioned Grand Jury proceeding do hereby waive all immunities and privileges from self-incrimination that I might otherwise be entitled to receive as a result of testifying in said Grand Jury proceeding. In witness hereof I have subscribed my name and it's signed Gescard Isnora and it's sworn to and signed by the foreman on the 7th day of March 2007 and it bears the foreperson's signature.

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At this time I am going to ask you to stand again and please face the foreman and raise your

right hand.I ask the foreman to please swear Detective

Isnora in as a witness.

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G.N. 2204

DETECTIVE GESCARD ISNORA,SHIELD NUMBER 3137, OCCB, was called as a

witness, having first been duly sworn, testified as follows:BY MR. TESTAGROSSA:

MR. REESE: I will turn it over to EADA Charles Testagrossa.

Q. Detective, I am going to ask you to pull your chair forward to the microphone and pull the microphone down to your mouth and try and speak loud so everyone can hear you.

A. Yes. Q. Detective, how old are you? A. Twenty-eight years old. Q. Are you married, sir? A. No. Q. By the way, do you have a nickname that your

colleagues call you? A. They call me Jess or Jesse. Q. When was it that you started in NYPD? A. July 2nd of '01, 2001. Q. After you left the police academy, what was your

first assignment? A. My first assignment was I was assigned to

Brooklyn North 81st Precinct.

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Q. Was that an assignment as a uniformed police officer?

A. Yes. Q. What was your function as a uniformed police

officer in that precinct? A. Patrol. Q. So were you on patrol generally in a marked RMP

or squad car? A. Marked RMP, yes. Q. RMP is an acronym for a squad car, is that

correct? A. Yes. Q. How long were you assigned to that assignment? A. Approximately three years. Q. Did there come a time when you moved on to

another assignment? A. Yes. Q. What was the next assignment you received? A. My next assignment I was assigned to the

Organized Crime Control Bureau in February of '05. Q. Were you assigned to OCCB or to a particular

unit?A. I was assigned to a particular unit, Narcotics

Division. Q. In what borough or command?

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G.N. 2206

A. The borough is Brooklyn North. Q. So you were assigned to Brooklyn North Narcotics?

A. Yes. Q. What year was that? A. March 2005. Q. Being assigned to Brooklyn North Narcotics as

part of the Organized Crime Control Bureau, did you have to undergo any additional and specialized training?

A. Yes. We are required to undergo a one month training as an undercover to identify the packaging of different types of drugs.

Q. Do you recall some of the other subject matters that might have been covered in that course?

A. Maybe terminology of drugs. Q. Basically the training was in reference to

prepare you to work in drug enforcement, is that correct?

A. Yes, buying drugs. Q. Was this undercover training that you received or

investigator training? A. It was undercover training. Q. Once you received this training, what did you do

after that? A. After the training I was then assigned to

Brooklyn North Narcotics.

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Q. Then during your assignment to Brooklyn North Narcotics, did you operate as an undercover?

A. Yes. Q. Did you ever operate in any other roles? A. No. Q. Did you ever operate as a ghost in any operation? A. Yes, as a ghost also. Q. So you worked as both undercover and ghost in

that assignment? A. Yes. Q. Did there come a time when that assignment came

to an end and you went on to a different assignment? A. Yes. The assignment as undercover hasn't changed

status wise, but I then moved on to Queens Narcotics. It was very brief. Once I got to the building, I was then told I was assigned to the Vice Enforcement Unit.

Q. When you say the Vice Enforcement Unit, do you mean the Club Enforcement Unit?

A. Yes, Social Club Task Force. Q. So when you left Brooklyn North Narcotics, your

assignment to Queens Vice was pretty much for a couple of hours and as soon as you reported -- I am trying to clarify that, sorry, go ahead.

A. Well, the Social Club Task Force was a temporary assignment and so when the assignment ended in that

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G.N. 2208

capacity, I would go to Queens Narcotics. Q. When was it that you were assigned to Queens

Narcotics and, I guess, ultimately to the Club Enforcement Unit?

A. It was October of '05. I'm sorry, October '06. Q. Where was the Club Enforcement Unit based? A. It was in the 7th Precinct in Manhattan. Q. When you were assigned to the Club Enforcement

Unit, who was the commanding officer at that time? A. At the time it was Captain Ehrenberg. Q. Did there come a time after you arrived there

where he was no longer the commanding officer? A. Yes. I would say maybe a period of maybe a

couple of weeks. Q. After he left who was either the commanding

officer or highest ranking officer in the unit? A. It was Captain Burns. Q. Was Captain Burns directly involved in the

day-to-day operations of the unit or was there another officer who basically supervised you day to day?

A. Yes, it was Lieutenant Napoli, but he answered to Captain Burns.

Q. When you arrived at the Club Enforcement Unit, do you recall who the other detectives were who were assigned to that unit?

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A. Yes. Q. Who were they that you remember?

A. Very briefly I remember Detective Edness, Graham, Sanchez, Oliver, Carey, Headley and Detective Capers.

Q. And what about Cooper? A. Sorry, also Detective Cooper. Q. What month was it that you came into the unit? A. It was October. Q. Approximately a month or month and a half prior

to the incident that took place, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. In that month or month and a half that you were

assigned to the unit before the date of November 24th, 2006, were you involved in any other of the unit's operations?

A. Yes. Q. When you arrived in the unit, what was the

geographic area of responsibility that it was working with?

A. Mostly concentrated in the borough of Queens, mostly Queens South.

Q. When you arrived in the unit, the geographic focus of the unit was Queens South?

A. Yes. Q. Are you familiar with a location called the Kalua

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G.N. 2210

Club? A. Yes.

Q. Prior to the date of November 24th of 2006, were you involved in any operations with the Kalua Club?

A. Yes. Q. When was that in reference to Friday,

November 24th, 2006? A. Approximately -- I believe it was three days

prior to that, either Monday or Tuesday, where I went to the Club Kalua and my job was basically to buy drugs.

Q. This is either the Monday or Tuesday, a couple of days before the date of the incident that we are here for, you were involved in an operation with the Kalua, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. On this date were you operating as an undercover? A. Well, it's almost like dual status in a way as an

undercover, me buying drugs, and also my partner was to engage -- I would be his ghost.

Q. So you're working as both a ghost and an undercover on this date?

A. Yes. Q. Just explain then what you were doing to the

Members of the Grand Jury on this date working as both a ghost and an undercover.

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A. Basically we both went into the club and we had like this understanding where -- sorry. The mission was

for me to buy drugs and if I couldn't, he would try to see if he could get an offer from one of the strippers in the club for prostitution.

Q. Let me clarify one thing. Who was the other person who went into the club on this date?

A. It was Detective Sanchez, Officer Garcia and myself.

Q. On that date, a couple of days earlier than the date of the incident, were you able to have any success in what you were attempting to do?

A. That night I purchased a quantity of cocaine from a female stripper and I believe Detective Sanchez had an offer from the same female for prostitution.

Q. At the end of the evening, were you and the other members of your unit able to effect an arrest?

A. Yes. The members of the field team were able to effect an arrest that night.

Q. Do you remember how many subjects were arrested? A. It was two. Q. Were they male or female? A. Both females. Q. Do you recall the manner in which the arrest was

effected that night?

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A. Well, the females, once they left the club, they got into the car with Detective Sanchez and Officer

Garcia and the field team then stopped them a couple of blocks away.

Q. Do you recall if that was a traffic stop sort of? A. Yes. Q. The car that they got into, was that the

undercover car? A. Yes. Q. Just to clarify, then the other officers who you

were working with that night who were also acting as undercovers brought the two subjects, the two female subjects with them into their car and a couple of blocks removed from the club there was a car stop and they were arrested, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. Prior to November 24th, 2006 you had visited the

Kalua Club, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. I am going to direct your attention over to

Friday, November 24th, 2006. Were you working on this date?

A. Yes. Q. What was your tour of duty on this day? A. My tour was 2127 by 0600 which is also 9:00 p.m.

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by 6:00 a.m. Q. Just one thing I omitted to mention as we began

the proceeding this afternoon, you are aware of the fact that you do have the right under the Criminal Procedure Law to give your testimony in a form of an uninterrupted narrative before I ask you questions. You understand that?

A. Yes. Q. It was my understanding that after conferring

with your attorney you asked that we go forward in the form of a question and answer until we got to the night of the incident, at which point you would proceed in a narrative, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. And that was done by your choice with

consultation with your attorney, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. I will just have a couple more questions then.

Do you recall about what time it was that you went to the 7th Precinct on Friday, November 24th, 2006?

A. I got there about 9:00 p.m. I signed in at 9:27. Q. Thereafter, did you have any meetings with the

other members of your unit? A. Yes. Once there was a Tac plan ordered -- a Tac

plan is where they organize what assignments the

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G.N. 2214

officers were going to do for that night and the locations of the clubs that we were supposed to go to.

Q. Do you recall about what time that meeting took place?

A. I would say approximately 11:00 p.m., around that time. I'm not too sure.

Q. Do you recall who else was present for the meeting?

A. Yes. The supervisor, Lieutenant Napoli, and the field team members.

Q. Who were the other members of the field team that day, as you recall?

A. Detective Cooper, Detective Headley, Detective Oliver, Detective Sanchez, Edness, Graham and Officer Carey.

Q. Who was it who conducted the Tac meeting at that time?

A. Lieutenant Napoli. Q. Do you recall if during the course of the Tac

meeting the different roles of each of the members of the team for the evening was discussed?

A. Yes. Q. Do you recall who it was who was going to be the

arresting officer? A. I believe so, yes.

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Q. Who was that? A. I believe it was Detective Cooper.

Q. Do you recall how many vehicles were going to be used that night?

A. There was the AO, the leader car, you had the chase car and the car that we use.

Q. You have the undercover car, the leader car would be where your captain would be?

A. Yes. Q. Was there going to be some kind of vehicle in

case there were prisoners? A. Yes, the prisoner van. Q. So there were three vehicles? A. Yes. Q. I think a moment ago you said you thought that it

was Detective Cooper who was going to be the arresting officer. Are you sure about that?

A. I'm not too sure, I'm sorry. Q. So you're not certain about that. Do you recall

which of the members of your team were going to be in which cars?

A. I know that Officer Carey and Detective Oliver were, I believe, the P-Van, the prisoner van.

Q. Who was going to be in the same vehicle as you? A. Detective Sanchez, Graham and Edness.

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Q. Was that the undercover car? A. Yes.

Q. Do you recall who was going to be in the leader car with the Lieutenant?

A. Cooper and Paul Headley. Q. Do you recall if during the course of that Tac

meeting the subject of the Kalua Club was discussed? A. Yes, that was discussed along with other clubs

that night. Q. What did the Lieutenant say with reference to the

Kalua Club? A. Being that a buy was made previously, he thought

that maybe we should go again that night to actually go close down the club under the Nuisance Abatement Program.

Q. Do you recall what other clubs it was discussed might be visited that evening by your unit?

A. Yes. Might have been -- I believe the name was Alicia's and there is another club in Spanish called Vasalone. There was another name, but I don't remember the name.

Q. But you recall that those names were mentioned, at any rate?

A. Yes. Q. Was there any mention by Lieutenant Napoli at

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that meeting anything about the future of the unit itself?

A. He made certain comments of the unit going back to Manhattan or that sort.

Q. Did there come a time when the Tac meeting was finished and the members of your unit began to proceed out to Queens for the night?

A. Yes. Once the Tac meeting was over and it was discussed the assignments and locations we were going to, we proceeded going to the location.

Q. Detective, at this point you may proceed in a narrative to tell the Members of the Grand Jury the events of that night.

A. Once we left the command, we all proceeded to the Club Kalua on 94th and Liverpool, and I'm sorry, I forgot the other cross street. That was around maybe 12:00 midnight that we left. We then arrived, I would say, close roughly around 1:00 a.m. and we parked on 95th, I think, between Allendale and, I believe, Brisbin and we sat there to wait for our supervisor to come and actually tell us that everyone was set. Once we got to the location, I discussed with Detective Sanchez that since he was going to go in first, to kind of like alert me if he saw the females from the previous night and only because -- the reason I had said that was because I

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G.N. 2218

didn't want them to know who I was and they would tell everyone else who I was, which is a cop. Several

minutes later the leader showed up and he called Detective Sanchez and asked us for our location and once he asked for our location, then I believe he instructed the field team, other members, of where they were going to be positioned but we don't know where. It was then discussed that Detective Sanchez was going to go in first and that once he was inside, he was going to alert the supervisor, you know, that it was okay for me to go inside. I believe about 1:15 Detective Sanchez exited the vehicle. The supervisor had given us what we call the green light and he left the vehicle and walked to the club. Once inside, he then called the leader. I'm nervous, I'm sorry. He called the leader and Detective Cooper then called me and informed me that Detective Sanchez had not seen the females inside and basically for me that I was able to go inside. I got in the club, I would say, about quarter to two. I walked towards Liverpool down towards --

Q. Detective, here's a laser pointer so you can point out on Grand Jury Exhibit 1 what you just described.

A. My path to the club -- I believe that's Liverpool there and the street up there is 94th and I made the

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G.N. 2219

left. I made my way into the club. MR. TESTAGROSSA: Just indicating for the

record that Detective Isnora, by use of the laser pointer, has indicated on Grand Jury Exhibit number 1 that he went north on Liverpool Street and made a left and went west on 94th Avenue to the club.

Q. Please continue. A. Once I approached the club, there was a bouncer

at the -- I wouldn't say in front of the doorway, but it was a vestibule -- and once I got in, he proceeded to frisk me moderately, light frisk, and I paid the fee, the cover charge there, I believe it was $10. Once I got in, I met up with Detective Sanchez. He was standing at the bar I think speaking with a female there. Once I got there, he had bought me a drink and basically I just sat down. My thing was to actually just survey the club, to just look around. Several minutes later a female had walked towards me and, you know, she had asked me to buy her a drink. The female was maybe about my height and I bought her champagne because that's what she had asked for so -- I'm sorry, I'm nervous. So I bought her the champagne and we just engaged in small talk and basically my job is to play a role in there like the other patrons that are in there

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G.N. 2220

for whatever they are doing in there. I kind of got to her to ask her what she was doing after work. Basically

my job was to engage in some sort of offer, whether it be for drugs or prostitution. She kind of hinted that since she didn't know me that she wasn't going to do anything so she kind of walked off. Several minutes later there was another female and she came and same thing, she had asked me to buy her a drink, and I am very embarrassed, but I asked Detective Sanchez for money because I didn't have -- I had little money on me and basically when they ask for drinks and stuff like that, that's their way to feel comfortable in speaking to you so -- and that's what I did and again I engaged in small talk with the second female there. I asked her the same thing, you know, once I engaged in small talk, what she was doing after work and she, you know, of course hinted also that she doesn't do that kind of thing so I spoke briefly with Detective Sanchez and I told him, you know, that I was going to call Detective Cooper to come in. I don't know how I could go about this, but usually when I ask for somebody else because I don't feel safe in a certain location and usually when I have -- I like one or two other persons in there. I don't know how to bring it out, but basically I called Detective Cooper just to feel for my safety and once he

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came in, he sat down and there was a third female. She was dancing on the pole at the bar and she had said

something to me, I don't know, very brief what she said. She said why you by yourself, something like that, and she had walked around the dancing area. She walked around towards my area and she was standing between me and Detective Cooper and basically again we engaged in small talk there. I had asked her, you know, if she wanted a drink. I called the waitress, I ordered a drink at the table because a lot of times when you go into these places, you just sit there. A lot of people, they know that they're neighborhood people that come in, they're usual faces that come in, so when they see a new face, they could think you're a cop or something else so I ordered a drink just to make it look like I am part of the scene and once the female -- you know, we engaged in small talk about engaging the offer for prostitution, she began dancing and we tipped her. Several minutes later she mentioned that there was an individual at the bar that was harassing her, kept calling her over and what have you, and I didn't pay no mind. She kind of moved from between me and Cooper and she kind of moved to my left side so instead -- Cooper was on my right-hand side, she was standing in the middle and I am on her left side so she moved from between us to the

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G.N. 2222

other side. She stood there for several moments and she noticed someone coming in that she knew. She kind of

called the person over. The individual had walked by and she grabbed his attention by grabbing his arm and spoke to him briefly. I'm not too sure exactly what the initial conversation was, but she had mentioned that to this person. He was wearing a white long sleeve shirt, a White Sox baseball cap. She mentioned to the individual that there was a patron in the club harassing her and the individual then looked and kind of said oh, him over there and -- sorry. After she said what she said about the individual harassing her, the guy with the White Sox hat said well, if he is going to continue it, let him know and he would take care of it. At the same time, he took her hand and placed it on his right hip area. When he did that kind of like nonchalantly, I made sure that I wasn't in their conversation because I didn't want this guy to say anything to me. So once that was done, I noticed there was a bulge on his right hip area and when I saw that, I kind of like turned to Cooper and I said I think he has a gun. Detective Cooper then notified the supervisor, Lieutenant Napoli, of what transpired there. I noticed the individual then walked off towards, I believe, the back of the club area. Several moments later she was talking again. She

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G.N. 2223

was speaking about Las Vegas where she would celebrate her birthday and several moments later, I would say

five, ten minutes later, I looked at my watch and I told Detective Cooper it was time to go. We then walked out of the club and I assumed Detective Sanchez was behind me walking out the same time and me and Detective Cooper walked up towards Liverpool on 94th and at the corner I turned around, noticed Sanchez didn't come out or wasn't there. So once we were on the corner, he then telephoned the supervisor, the Lieutenant, and informed him he was going back to the car. Then I believe I may have used my phone or his phone to call Detective Edness who was driving the -- I drove there, but she was in the car when I got out -- so I asked her to meet me between 95th and 94th, I guess, on Liverpool and that's where she pulled up, between 94th and 95th on Liverpool. I briefly told her that Detective Sanchez was still in the club and I retrieved my weapon and my shield from the vehicle. Very briefly before I even continue on to explain when I went to the club, as an undercover -- before I was transferred to Vice, as undercovers we are supposed to carry our firearms and what happens -- I don't know how to bring it out, but when we are out on the street, it's just me and the ghost. The field team is out there, but they are usually several blocks away,

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G.N. 2224

and what I am trying to say is that as undercovers a lot of us, we carry our weapons and basically for when we in

the street, several areas where we work at, you never know if people come around and thinking you're somebody else that they had problems with in the past, you know, because areas where we work in, we buy drugs, they are dangerous. I retrieved my service weapon and shield and returned back to the club and waited for Detective Sanchez out in front. I was standing a few feet from the doorway which is a like a gated area, metal area, I think.

Q. If you don't mind me interrupting for a moment, if you look behind you, the Exhibit Grand Jury 5A or B may be helpful for you to indicate to the Members of the Grand Jury where you went.

A. Do you mind if I stand? Q. If it's helpful for you to stand there and get

near the exhibit, go right ahead. A. This is the club here and a couple of feet away

is like a gated area. I don't know if it's a garage or an auto shop, but I was standing right --

Q. I just want to make a record of what you indicated.

MR. TESTAGROSSA: Detective Isnora has pointed on Grand Jury Exhibit 5B to a gated area

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G.N. 2225

which is directly to the east of the entrance of the Kalua Club on this exhibit.

Q. Go ahead, continue. A. Once I retrieved my weapon and I went back to the

club, I stood in front just waiting for Detective Sanchez to come out and I believe he stood in there to -- he didn't come out. I think he stood in there to take the individual with the White Sox hat and white long sleeve shirt so I just basically waited for him outside and waited for him to come out. Couple of minutes later, he did -- I'm sorry, let me backtrack. Before he came out, there was a black SUV that pulled up in front of the club. I'm not sure of the make or model. The vehicle was right in front of this location which is the club.

MR. TESTAGROSSA: Just for the record, the witness has used the laser pointer to point to the entrance of the club on Exhibit 5B in evidence.

A. It was a black SUV that pulled up in front of the location and the driver of the black SUV exited the vehicle and walked in front of the hood and stood on the passenger side door of his car and just -- he was there basically waiting for somebody, whoever it was. Shortly thereafter there was a female that walked out of the

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G.N. 2226

club and walked over to this individual. Both of them engaged in a small conversation. I don't know as to

what, I wasn't paying attention. Shortly after she came out the club, Detective Sanchez came out and I believe he was on the phone with Lieutenant Napoli. As to what I'm not exactly sure, but he was on the phone with the leader. He then walked over and walked -- I'm sorry. He stood right next to me and we were both waiting basically to point out the individual with the White Sox hat and the long sleeve shirt. Several moments after there was a group of males that exited the club. I would say maybe about seven or eight. They exited the club and they were hovering close near the front entrance of the club and more where I was standing but closer to the street where I was basically by the gated area. We both were standing out there and we were still waiting for the individual to come out which we haven't seen yet and we, you know, began to hear like a loud commotion, like an intense argument between the group of males that came out and the female that was with the owner of the black SUV and it was like a big argument and the only thing you kind of heard -- I'm sorry, I left a part out. While we were in front of the club and the argument between both parties, the female and the group of guys that was there, and basically the female

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G.N. 2228

Avenue east to Liverpool Street. Q. Please continue.

A. Once I informed the Lieutenant of the direction where the group of males were going, he instructed me to see where they were going, follow them, follow where they were actually going. I did not follow closely behind them because I didn't want them to think that I was with the individual with the SUV to retaliate after what just happened so I gave them enough room so they couldn't see somebody was following them. I noticed that the three individuals from the group took off to the corner of the location which was Liverpool and 94th and right before then, I had taken out my shield from my pocket, I had clipped it to my collar of my sweater, my neck area, I clipped it there.

MR. TESTAGROSSA: Just for the record, the witness has reached to his shirt collar with his right hand indicating that he had clipped his shield up and around the right collar just by his neck.

Q. Is that right?A. Yes. Q. Go ahead. A. Once I had clipped it, I had held it for several

moments as I passed the group on the corner because I

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G.N. 2229

didn't want to tip anybody off as to, you know -- I guess I didn't want to tip them off who I was and so I

removed my service weapon as I crossed the street and I noticed the vehicle was parked, the headlights were on and as I walked towards the vehicle area, I noticed Bell and Guzman in the front seat. I walked and I stated police, don't move, police, don't move. I identified myself several times. Several moments later the car -- the driver floored the car, struck me in my leg. I then kind of stumbled onto the hood of the car and maybe close to the sidewalk to regain my balance. I then went -- I'm sorry, let me backtrack. As I crossed the street, I noticed the lieutenant's car passing me by and I kind of instructed that that's the car there, but they were going so fast that they passed the vehicle that they were in. Once the vehicle had struck my leg, it then hit the P-Van, the prisoner van, and I noticed that the car then raced back. It was going to hit me again and instead it hit the metal garage of an auto shop. Once -- I'm sorry, I'm nervous. Once it struck the van and it raced back to hit me again, I noticed the passenger seat that Guzman was sitting in. I was watching him even from the beginning. I had eye contact with him from the beginning when I first got to the vehicle, and after it struck my leg, I maintained focus

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G.N. 2230

on Guzman only because when he said get my gun, get my gun so I felt in my mind something's up here, why, you

know, they racing out of the location. I kept noticing that he was going in his waistband in the beginning. When I first got there, when I said police, don't move, he was going into his waistband area and after -- I'm sorry, I don't know if I am putting it chronological so you can see it -- once it hit the gated area in the back and went back for the second time, I seen -- I was watching the passenger side and I noticed that he kept reaching in his waistband area, but all the while I kept saying police, don't move, police, don't move. I said it several times and I know they saw my shield because it was clipped on my collar area. I noticed that his arm was going up in an upward motion and I yelled gun and my mind, I felt that he had a gun and I couldn't wait anymore. I don't know, it happened so quick. It was like the last thing that I ever wanted to do. I am trying to put it to you this way, last thing I wanted to do. I felt maybe if I waited a second longer, he would have fired at me and I know he was going to do the drive-by of the owner of the SUV, black SUV, because of what transpired earlier. I'm sorry, I am just -- once I seen the arm go up, I fired. I yelled gun and I fired. In my mind I knew that he had a gun in my mind and, like

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G.N. 2231

I said, it's the last thing that I wanted to do there and moments thereafter, the firing ceased. I noticed

that Benefield was running from the back passenger side. He was running and I seen Detective Headley run after him and I thought maybe, I don't know, he was running because he had the weapon or what have you and so I followed Headley because I didn't want him to be by himself. While I was running, he then -- I guess he had to take Benefield down because he kept running. He took him down and once he was down, we called 911 for an ambulance and I guess for several units to show up. Before I finish I want to explain to you that in my time as an undercover I had many dangerous situations where I have been robbed, I have been -- fights were being started and basically what I am trying to say, I never fired my weapon before. I never had any intentions of in my career actually even thinking about doing that. My intention was not there whatsoever and, like I said, my time as an undercover where these situations has posed -- basically what I am trying to say, using my weapon was not even in my mind. It was the last thing I wanted to do. I felt I had no choice that night and I thought that they were either going to fire at the owner of the black SUV or me or the other guys in the field team. Lastly, coupled with the experience I had as an

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G.N. 2232

undercover, I had gun arrests where, for example, one individual did actually pull the trigger while I was

effecting the arrest and basically what I am trying to say, I gained control and I don't know if I am saying it right, I don't know, I'm nervous, I'm sorry. Last thing I would like to say is I pray for everything. I pray for the individuals for what happened that night and, like I said, what happened that night did not even come across me. It was the last thing I ever wanted to happen and the only thing I can say, I wish the vehicle had stopped, you know, and I wouldn't have been here, but I felt I had no choice.

Q. Detective, have you finished with your statement? A. Yes. Q. I want to go through a couple of things with you.

I am going to ask you to look at Grand Jury Exhibit 16A-9 which we are going to show you on the computer monitor. Do you recognize what's depicted in that photo?

A. Yes. Q. What is that? A. It's the clothing that I wore that night. Q. That photo actually has your head cut off so the

question I have for you is, were you wearing any hat that night?

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G.N. 2233

A. Yes, I was. Q. What kind of hat were you wearing?

A. Like a black baseball cap with a New York logo. Q. Yankees or Mets, do you remember? A. New York Jets. Q. Can you recall what the color was? A. It was a white insignia, black hat. Q. Black hat, white logo? A. Yes. Q. I ask you to look at a photo which is in evidence

as 16A-16. Do you recognize that, 16A-16? A. Yes. That's what we call my off-duty weapon. As

undercovers we are allowed to carry that on duty.Q. An authorized weapon for undercovers to utilize,

is that correct? A. Yes. Q. That's a photograph of your weapon? A. Yes. Q. Just if you would look at 16A-17, does that photo

also depict your weapon? A. Yes. Q. Just to go back through a couple of things. You

indicated, I believe, earlier that when you went into the club you were frisked, is that correct?

A. Yes.

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G.N. 2234

Q. And I believe you pointed with the laser pointer to the vestibule of the club as depicted in Grand Jury

Exhibit 4, is that correct? A. I believe -- that's the vestibule area? Q. Yes.

MR. TESTAGROSSA: For the record, the witness has again pointed out the vestibule area on Grand Jury Exhibit 4.

Q. I am going to ask you to look at Grand Jury Exhibit 4A-8 which, again, we will show you on the computer monitor. Do you recognize that?

A. Yes. Q. Does that photo depict the vestibule area you're

talking about? A. Yes. That area, yes. Q. You said that you went into the club. I am going

to ask you to look at Grand Jury Exhibit 4A-9. Do you recognize what that exhibit depicts?

A. Yes, that's inside the club. Q. Do you see the area in that exhibit where you

were seated? A. I believe it was -- do you mind if I point to it? Q. Go right ahead. A. Mostly that area where that chair is. Not the

first one, but the second one.

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G.N. 2235

MR. TESTAGROSSA: For the record, the witness has indicated the chair that's the second

closest to the front of the photograph. Q. So you were basically seated at the corner of the

bar that was closest to the front entrance, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. Just going back to events that take place at the

bar, there comes a time when you arrive in the bar. Detective Sanchez is already there, correct?

A. Yes. Q. And after a while it's your recollection that you

called Detective Cooper and asked Detective Cooper to come in?

A. Yes. Q. Then there is a point when Detective Cooper comes

into the club, correct? A. Yes. Q. Do you recall about what time that was when

Detective Cooper comes in? A. I would say maybe roughly half hour after I came

in. Q. About what time do you figure you came into the

club? A. I would say around 1:45.

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G.N. 2236

Q. So approximately 2:15, thereabouts? A. Yes.

Q. You indicated when you first went into the club and you started speaking to a woman at the bar you had a drink, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. What did you have? A. It was a rum and Coke. Q. Did you have other drinks during your stay in the

bar? A. Yes. I had -- well, let me put it this way. I

had like two Cokes afterwards. The first one I did not finish. I really don't drink alcohol for the simple fact that as an undercover you have to maintain like a level of awareness and, like I said, in my prior past where you're on the street, you have to maintain some sort of awareness, you have to know your surroundings and I felt that doing so would be detrimental to myself and others.

Q. So your testimony is that you ordered one alcoholic beverage and then two Cokes after that?

A. No. I ordered -- Sanchez had ordered an alcoholic beverage for me.

Q. What did he order you? A. It was a rum and Coke. The second one I ordered,

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G.N. 2237

it was for one of the females that were there. I basically just left it there.

Q. What did you buy for the female, if you remember? A. She had asked for champagne and then she kind of

asked what I was drinking so I ordered another rum and Coke.

Q. So that second rum and Coke was for the woman? A. Yes. Q. After that did you order any more drinks? A. No. It was like a soda, a regular Coke. Q. You indicated that as you were seated at the bar

in the area that you indicated you spoke to a few women, I guess one after the other as they came up to you, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. One of the women that you spoke to you indicated

had a conversation with a man whose arm she grabbed, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. She spoke to him, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. This man is the man who you described as having a

long sleeve white shirt with a White Sox baseball cap, is that correct?

A. Yes.

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G.N. 2239

A. Well, while he stated that he just kind of like grabbed her arm and put it on his right hip area and

when he did that, I noticed briefly there was a bulge right in his right hip area.

Q. And you saw this bulge? A. Yes. Q. Where was this bulge located so the jury can be

clear, the bulge you're talking about? A. It was on his right hip area. Q. Was it at the level of his waist or his belt or

lower? A. No, it was level with his waist area. Q. This bulge, whatever was causing the bulge, was

covered by something? A. Yes. He had a long white shirt and as soon as he

did that, he kind of tugged his shirt down to cover -- like he was covering something, concealing something.

Q. That's what you concluded from the actions you saw?

A. Yes. Q. You never saw what was under that area, is that

correct? A. No. Q. From that point on, was it your assumption that

this individual might have a gun?

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G.N. 2240

A. Yes. Q. I believe you said that you said as much to

Detective Cooper, is that correct? A. Yes. I stated to Detective Cooper what I seen,

what I saw. I said I think he has a weapon. Q. I believe you said that -- where did you see that

man go after you made these observations? A. Well, right after that I seen him walk towards

the back. I don't know exactly where he ventured off, but he was walking like he was going towards the back area of the club.

Q. Did you lose sight of him as he went to the back of the club?

A. Well, as he walked off, yes, I did lose sight. Q. Once you lost sight of him, did you ever see him

again? A. No. Q. And that would be from that point to today, is

that correct? A. Yes. Q. So there was at no time thereafter that you saw

this individual out on the street or in front of the club later that evening?

A. No, sir. Q. Now, I believe you indicated that shortly after

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G.N. 2241

that you told Detective Cooper it was time to go, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. Then you went outside the club? A. Yes. We both exited and I assumed that Sanchez

followed us when he saw us leave. Q. But, in fact, Sanchez had not left the club yet? A. No. Q. About what time of the evening are we talking

about now? A. I would say close to around -- I would say around

4:00 in the morning. Q. Now, had you been in the club up to that point? A. Once I left the location if I returned inside? Q. We are talking about now you made the

observations about the man the White Sox hat, correct? A. Yes. Q. And you talked to Detective Cooper about it,

correct? A. Yes. Q. And then you tell Detective Cooper it's time for

us to go, correct? A. Yes. Q. I am trying to figure out what time that is.

That's around 4:00?

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G.N. 2242

A. Yes. Q. Or is that earlier than that?

A. No, it was after. Right after the encounter with the White Sox hat.

Q. I understand you left shortly after. I am trying to get a handle on the time you left when you stepped outside the club. Is it your best estimate that that was about 4:00?

A. Yes. Might have been earlier, but I am not too sure. I think it was around the neighborhood of 4:00.

Q. Then I believe you indicated that you called the undercover car and spoke to Edness?

A. Yes. Q. And asked Edness to come and pick you up? A. Yes. I basically told her -- well, at the time

when I called her, Sanchez wasn't there. I basically told her to come up on Liverpool.

Q. You met that vehicle somewhere on Liverpool Street?

A. Yes. It was between 94th and 95th. Q. With the laser pointer can you give an

approximation of where on Liverpool Street the car came and met you?

A. Here.Q. Say in the middle of the block?

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G.N. 2243

A. Yes. Q. About halfway between 94th and 95th?

A. Yes. Q. When the car met you, did you have any

conversation with the members of the team that were in the car?

A. In the undercover car was just Detective Edness and Detective Graham and I basically just said to Edness I was going to retrieve my firearm and shield and go back to the club and wait for Detective Sanchez.

Q. And that's in fact what you did, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. When you go back to the club to wait for

Detective Sanchez, is it your intention to wait for the man with the white long sleeve shirt and the White Sox hat?

A. Yes. Q. When you returned to the front of the club, I

believe you indicated that at that point there is a black SUV there, is that correct?

A. Yes. When I went back to the club, yes, there was a black SUV that arrived shortly thereafter.

Q. When you go back to the club, is the black SUV already there or does it arrive as you are standing out in front of the club?

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G.N. 2244

A. It arrives while I am standing in front of the club.

Q. So you see it pull up, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. At the time that it pulls up is Detective Sanchez

outside with you? A. No. At the time that it pulled up he was still

inside. Q. So at that point are you out in front of the club

by yourself? A. Yes. Q. The black SUV comes up and you indicated that the

driver of the vehicle got out of the car, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. Where did he go? A. He walked towards the front of his hood and he

stood on the passenger side of his door. Q. I believe you indicated also that shortly

thereafter a woman came out of the bar and had a conversation with him?

A. Yes. Q. That woman, did you overhear that conversation? A. No, I wasn't really paying attention as to what

they were talking about.

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G.N. 2245

Q. Does that woman stay there or does that woman leave?

A. When she got there, she stood there with the individual. At which point she left, I don't remember exactly because -- I'm sorry.

Q. No, that's fine. By the way, could you describe the person who went with the SUV that you saw outside of his SUV?

A. Very vaguely. He had like a dark colored jacket or I'm not sure, leather jacket, a little bit shorter than me.

Q. How tall are you, by the way, just for reference? A. Five-eleven. Q. So he was a little shorter than you at

five-eleven? A. Yes. That's all I can vaguely remember because,

again, the person was not my interest. Q. He is wearing dark clothes, he is a little

shorter than you. What was his race? A. He was male black. I don't know what race. Q. Was it your testimony then that a different woman

came out of the club and had a conversation with him or only one woman had a conversation with him?

A. With the owner of the SUV? Q. Yes.

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G.N. 2246

A. I saw one female. Q. Then I believe you said that other men started to

come out of the club? A. Yes. Shortly after she had exited the club the

group of males then followed behind her. Q. The group of males followed behind her? A. I mean -- I'm sorry, I mean -- when I say behind,

I mean not right away. I would say they came out a minute or two after.

Q. So when you said followed behind, you mean they came out of the club after she came out of the club?

A. Yes. Q. And this group of men, I guess, congregated in

front of the club?A. Yes. Q. Where were you standing in relation to this man

if you look behind you at Grand Jury Exhibit 5B? A. Do you mind if I step out? Q. Sure, go right ahead. You might see it more

clearly. A. I don't know if anyone can see, but this is the

front of the club here. Q. That is the front of the club you're pointing to

with your index finger, right? A. Yes. The black SUV was parked right here, right

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G.N. 2247

in front of the club. MR. TESTAGROSSA: Detective Isnora has

indicated directly at the end of the awning there, is that correct, of the club?

A. Yes. Q. Go ahead. A. I was standing around this area here towards the

gate. Q. The gated area directly to the east of the club,

is that correct? A. Yes. Q. The men that you saw congregate, where were they? A. They were -- some of them were by the hydrant and

there was a group standing by the hydrant and close to the hood of the vehicle.

Q. Why don't you come back and take your seat. MR. TESTAGROSSA: The jury has indicated

they would like a break for the restroom. I guess this is as good a time as any. Detective, why don't you just step outside, we will let the Grand Jury take a short break.

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G.N. 2248

DETECTIVE GESCARD ISNORA,was recalled as a witness, having previously been duly

sworn, testified further as follows:MR. REESE: Good afternoon, ladies and

gentlemen. We are back from break. I am ADA Peter Reese. With me at this time is EADA Charles Testagrossa, ADA Johnnette Traill and ADA Travis Hunter is at the computer.

Mr. Foreman, we had a break. Now we are back from the break. Is the same group that's been present all day actually present right now?

FOREPERSON: Yes. MR. REESE: We will continue with the

witness. BY MR. TESTAGROSSA:

Q. Detective Isnora, we are going to try and pick up where we left off and I believe we left off at the time you were outside the Kalua Club and there was an SUV there and you saw a group of men come out of the club, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. About how many men were in the group that you saw

come out of the club? A. Briefly I counted seven or eight. Q. Had you ever seen those men before?

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G.N. 2249

A. No. Q. Had you even seen them inside the club?

A. No. Q. So you were totally unfamiliar with them, is that

correct? A. Yes. Q. Then you indicated that you saw an argument, is

that correct? A. Yes. Q. I believe you stated that you saw Guzman say get

my gun, get my gun, is that correct? A. Yes. For some reason the individual, the owner

of the black SUV, said something to him that he emphatically said get my gun, get my gun.

Q. Now, you have never met Mr. Guzman before, is that correct?

A. I never met him. Q. And when you were seeing this person make the

statement outside the club, that's the first time you ever laid eyes on this individual, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. At the time that you're witnessing this comment

being made, you didn't know the name of the person who was making it, is that correct?

A. No.

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G.N. 2251

there and the black SUV pulled up, at the time Detective Sanchez was not there, is that correct?

A. No. At the time, no. Q. So at some point he came out? A. Yes. Q. Do you recall at what point in these events he

came out? A. Once the SUV pulled up and the owner of the SUV

exited the vehicle -- it was actually -- once the SUV pulled up and the individual got out, I would say a minute or two Detective Sanchez had came out.

Q. You also indicated that there was a woman who had come out and was speaking to the man in the SUV, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. What did that woman look like? Can you give us a

description of her? A. I mean, again, very vaguely. All I remember I

think she was carrying a bag and she was shorter than me, but I couldn't remember details because my focus wasn't really on them.

Q. Could you tell her race or ethnicity? Was she white, black, Hispanic?

A. I believe female black. Q. Female black?

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G.N. 2252

A. Yes, female black. Q. Had she been one of the women that you spoke to

inside the club? A. No, sir. Q. Had you seen her inside the club? A. If I did, I probably wouldn't recognize her

because females in the club weren't wearing clothes and when they come out, they are different.

Q. Just going back now to the phone conversation with Lieutenant Napoli and I believe I asked you whether you or Detective Sanchez spoke to Lieutenant Napoli after you witnessed this encounter outside the club. Which one was it, you or Sanchez or both who spoke to Lieutenant Napoli?

A. Both did. He was on the phone in the beginning and explained to the Lieutenant what had transpired and he handed me the phone and then he spoke with me, instructed me to basically see where they were going, follow them.

Q. Did you say anything to the Lieutenant or did you just listen to the Lieutenant?

A. I basically told the Lieutenant what just happened, that there was a group heading towards Liverpool on 94th.

Q. Did you say it's getting hot on Liverpool Street?

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G.N. 2253

A. No. Q. Now, going back to the man with the SUV, you

described his height and his race and a little bit about his clothing. Did you see anything about the way he was standing when he was talking with this group of men?

A. He was fidgeting. Like he had both arms in his jacket like he was fidgeting.

Q. When you say that he had his hands fidgeting with his jacket, did he have his hands in his jacket pocket?

A. Yes, he had his hands in his jacket pocket. Q. He had his hands in his jacket pocket and you

couldn't see if he had anything inside his pocket? A. I couldn't see. Q. As you watched him standing outside the club with

this encounter with this group of seven or eight men, did it occur to you that he might be holding a gun in his pocket?

A. Very possibly because of -- I don't know how to explain, but he seemed a bit nervous as to -- in his mind he probably thought something was going to happen maybe because of the comments he had made that sparked the comments from Guzman. But yes, in my mind he could have had a weapon.

Q. And because of the way he was holding his hands in his pocket?

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G.N. 2254

A. And the way he was clutching something in his pocket.

Q. Did you see him clutching something in his pocket?

A. Yes. Q. You said you told Lieutenant Napoli this group

was heading towards Liverpool Street? A. I'm sorry?Q. I will ask it again. You indicated to Lieutenant

Napoli that this group of men were heading towards Liverpool Street, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. Do you remember the exact words that you used, as

best you can, to Lieutenant Napoli? A. I basically told him that one of the individuals

said get a gun or to get my gun and I explained to him previously that there was several other males around him and they were walking towards Liverpool on 94th.

Q. Now, you indicated that Mr. Guzman said get my gun, go get my gun, something to that effect?

A. No, he was emphatic and loud. Q. But it's go get my gun? A. Get my gun. Q. That does not indicate that he has a gun, is that

correct, that statement, go get my gun?

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G.N. 2255

A. Yes. Q. When you conveyed this information to Lieutenant

Napoli, did you tell him the man made a reference to a gun?

A. Yes. Q. Not that the man had a gun? A. Yes. Q. Just clarify that. A. When I stated to him, I stated that the

individual said go get my gun and -- I'm sorry, that he had stated that to one of the guys in his group and the direction of where he was walking to.

Q. At this point did you see the group ever throw a punch at this male with the SUV?

A. No. Q. Did you see anything other than, I guess, words

being passed back and forth between the man and the group?

A. Well, once Guzman and Bell made comments, they kind of were walking off in a fast pace as like they were going to come back.

Q. What was it that indicated to you that they were going to come back? Do you recall what was said at that time?

A. I don't know. I can't recall exactly word for

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G.N. 2256

word. Q. Did you hear anything or anybody saying something

to the effect of come on, this isn't worth it, let's get out of here before they walked away?

A. No. Q. Did you hear anyone saying anything like come on,

we have more important stuff going on, let's just go? A. No. Q. Did you hear anybody say let's be out? A. No, I did not hear that. Q. The group heads towards the corner, is that

correct? A. Yes. Q. As the group heads towards the corner, do you

notice if there are any women on the street on this block?

A. On the corner of, I don't know. Q. Between the Kalua Club and the corner of 94th

Avenue and Liverpool Street, do you see any women out on the street?

A. No. The only female I seen was the female by the black SUV.

Q. By the way, what became of her, where did she go? A. Well, once the argument -- well, it didn't kind

of cease, but once the males walked off and I explained

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G.N. 2257

to the Lieutenant what had happened, my back was towards the female and the owner of the SUV so my sight was

towards them. Q. Did you ever look back in that direction? A. I didn't look back.Q. So you're not aware of whether the SUV actually

stayed in that location or whether it moved on? A. I can't say. Q. And you're not aware of whether that woman got in

the car with the man with the SUV and drove away or just walked away?

A. No, sir. My focus was towards the group. Q. The Lieutenant told you to follow the group, is

that correct? A. Yes, told me basically keep an eye on them, see

where they are going.Q. In your conversation with the Lieutenant you had

not given him any description of any particular individual, had you?

A. No. I explained to him that there was a group of males heading towards the location which was 94th and Liverpool and I told him it was a large group. They were the only ones out there at that time of the morning.

Q. At this point just prior to following this group

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G.N. 2258

down the block to the corner there were a couple of possibilities of individuals who might have guns at that

time, is that correct? A. From the group? Q. Just from the course of the night and the things

you had witnessed. A. I'm not understanding. Q. I will make it more clear. You had seen the man

with the White Sox hat gesture to his waist as if he had a gun, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. And you suspected he might have a gun, is that

correct? A. Yes. Q. And the last you had seen of him he was inside

the club? A. He was inside the club. Q. Now, you see the man outside the SUV with his

hands in his pocket like he is grasping an object which you indicated also could have been a gun, is that correct?

A. It could have been, but I just know he was grasping something.

Q. But it was a possibility that occurred to you, is that correct?

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G.N. 2259

A. Yes. Q. And these were two individuals, who if your

surmise was right, actually would have had weapons on them, is that correct?

A. The group? Q. The White Sox hat man and the SUV man. A. Yes. Q. If what you were inferring from what you saw was

correct, those were men who actually had weapons on them?

A. Yes. Q. With reference to Mr. Guzman, you say you heard

him say go get my gun, is that correct? A. Yes. He stated to an individual from his group,

he stated get my gun, get my gun several times. Q. Which would seem to imply that he did not have a

gun on him at that time, is that correct? A. Correct. Q. You chose at that point to follow the man who

might have a gun, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. Now, you saw some members of the group break off

from the group, is that correct? A. Correct. Q. Did you see any of those men, perhaps one or two

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G.N. 2260

of them, stop to talk to a woman along the block before you got to the corner?

A. Actually, I did not see actually where if they were having a conversation. I just knew that they branched off and stood at the corner. I'm sorry. I guess my focus was just to see where the group was going because they were standing and from my thinking, I thought they were being lookouts as to what took place with the heated argument, that maybe the guy would come after them and these guys were at the corner to alert the others.

Q. You had mentioned earlier, you were talking about you feared that there might be a drive-by. Who was going to be the object of the drive-by?

A. The owner of the SUV. Q. Did you look back to see whether the SUV was

still there? A. No, I did not. Q. So you weren't even sure that the SUV was still

in that position, is that correct? A. When I went to follow the individuals, I could

not say if they were there or not. Q. You indicated that when you came to Liverpool

Street, as you got to Liverpool Street, you took out your shield and I believe clipped it to your collar, is

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G.N. 2261

that correct? A. Correct, but it happened just before I got to the

corner. Q. So then you were still on 94th Avenue, is that

correct? A. Yes. Q. 94th Avenue approaching the corner of Liverpool

Street? A. Yes. Q. You took out your weapon as well? A. No. I had the ID there. Once I passed the

individuals on the corner, I then pulled out my weapon. Q. So you pulled out your weapon, if I have it

correct, as you were at the corner of 94th Avenue and Liverpool Street just as you passed those three individuals?

A. As I passed, yes, the individuals, I pulled out my weapon.

Q. Do you recall whether you were still on the western sidewalk of Liverpool Street when you pulled it out or you were in the street?

A. I believe I was in the street. Q. So you pulled it out -- if you could with the

laser pointer, could you point out on Grand Jury Exhibit 1 approximately where you were when you pulled out your

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G.N. 2262

firearm? A. Yes.

Q. Indicating that you basically had stepped off of the curb on the western side into the street?

A. Yes. Q. At that point you had your firearm out, is that

correct? A. Yes. Q. You had previously already taken out your shield

and put it as you indicated? A. Yes. Q. And you had done that before you passed by these

three men? A. Before I passed by the three men, I clipped it on

here. Q. And as you passed them on Liverpool you had to

cover it up so they couldn't see it? A. Yes. Right after I passed by them -- it was

covered and as soon as I passed by them, that's when I reached out for my weapon.

Q. What was it that you observed as you looked down the street at that time?

A. I noticed the individuals in the car with the headlights on and it was parked.

Q. Now, did you actually see the men get in the car

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G.N. 2263

or were they already in the car when you turned the corner?

A. As I turned the corner, like very briefly the door had closed.

Q. Which door do you remember closing? A. I heard a noise. I think it was the rear

passenger side. Q. You didn't see anybody get in through the closing

door? A. No. Q. How far were you from that vehicle when you saw

these people in the front seat in the car? A. Around the same area when I pulled out my weapon. Q. So pretty much when you stepped off the curb and

pulled out your weapon and you looked at that vehicle you could see two men in the front seat of it?

A. Yes. Q. And you could tell from that distance who those

two men were?A. From the distance, yes, I was able to see the

driver and the passenger. Q. I assume you were seeing them through the front

windshield? A. Yes. Q. And you could see that these were the people you

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G.N. 2264

have identified as Mr. Bell and Mr. Guzman? A. Yes. As I got closer, I maintained eye contact

through the front windshield with the two individuals. Q. Then you approached the vehicle, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. When you approached the vehicle, did you stand

directly in front of it? A. Yes. This is the front of the vehicle and yes, I

was right there between -- I was like -- maybe might have been a gap like this wide or little bit back, but I was in front and I was able to see in the front of the vehicle.

Q. Just to make it clear, if we use the two headlights as a guide post, were you standing directly between the two front headlights?

A. I was standing more closely -- a little towards the passenger side, but yes, it was close to the center, but more close to the center left.

Q. Close to the center of the hood, but a little closer to the passenger side headlight?

A. Yes. Q. At what point was it that you said anything to

the people in the vehicle? How close were you to the vehicle?

A. I was right there in front. I said police, don't

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G.N. 2265

move, police, don't move. I was loud. Q. Police, don't move, is the first thing you said

to them? A. Yes. Q. Did you say let me holler at you? A. No. Q. You did not say that? A. No, no, no. Q. So you immediately identified yourself as a

police officer? A. Yes. I had my shield out, I stated police, don't

move, police, don't move. Q. But you can't say whether they saw your shield,

correct? A. Well, the headlights were on and it was glaring. Q. You can say where you had it and the lights were

on, but you can't really say whether they saw it? A. No. Q. And you called out police right at that time? A. Yes, I did. Q. What was the next thing that happened? A. I would say a second later the car floored and

hit my leg. Q. Go ahead. A. I just wanted to say it was very quick, split

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G.N. 2266

second. As soon as I said police, don't move, police, don't move, boom, hit my leg.

Q. This was a vehicle that was at a park, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. It was not in motion at all? A. No. Q. And so when it clips you it's likely going about

a foot before it hits you because you're standing only a foot away from it, would that be fair to say?

A. Yes. Q. And you were standing where you indicated towards

the center but a little bit more towards the passenger side, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. And as the car comes out of the spot, it hits you

in your right shin, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. But you're able to get out of the way of the

vehicle, is that correct? A. Once it struck me, I kind of stumbled a little to

the hood and then on the sidewalk. I didn't actually fall, I maintained my balance.

Q. Did you maintain your balance by putting your hands on the hood of the car?

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G.N. 2267

A. Yes. It was a little bit of both. Like to the car and then briefly to the sidewalk, I got up.

Q. So just for clarification, do you remember if you put either one or both of your hands on the hood to try to stabilize yourself?

A. Yes. Q. Was it one or two? A. One. Q. Would that be the hand that did not have the

weapon in it? A. Yes. Q. And at that point you were now at the side of the

vehicle, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. Now, up to this point you had not discharged your

firearm? A. No. Q. There is a collision immediately after that, is

that correct? A. Yes. Once it struck my leg, it then collided

with the P-Van. Q. When it collided with the P-Van, did you notice

anything about your fellow team members who were in the P-Van?

A. Very vaguely, no, because my vision was towards

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G.N. 2268

the passenger, the individual that I previously saw that said get my gun. My focus was towards the passenger of

the car. Q. Now, after the vehicle has hit you, do you shout

any additional commands? A. I just remember I kept saying police, don't move,

put your hands up, police, don't move. It was quick and I was scared.

Q. Did you also ask them to show their hands? A. Yes, in the midst of me saying police, don't

move, I said show me your hands. Q. Basically you said police, don't move, police,

don't move and additionally you said show your hands, show your hands?

A. Yes. Q. You said you then observed movement by Mr. Guzman

within the vehicle, is that correct? A. Yes. Like he just -- I kept -- like I said, I

kept my focus on to the side in the passenger window and I kept noticing the waistband movement with both hands as he is going to reach for something in his waistband.

Q. Could you tell for certain that he wasn't putting on a seat belt?

A. No, he was not putting on a seat belt. Q. How could you be certain of that, you saw

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G.N. 2269

movement around his waist? A. Because he is actually reaching like this, he is

not going like this. Q. So now you also said show your hands, is that

correct? A. Yes. I stated police, don't move, police, don't

move, then show your hands, show your hands. Q. Do you see a problem in giving those two orders

at the same time, don't move and show your hands? A. I'm not too sure as -- I mean, I am trying to say

I was nervous and all I kept thinking was that the individual had a gun.

Q. Well, after that point now that you hear the collision and the vehicle, what's the next thing that happens?

A. Sorry. After it hits the first time, I just noticed that it was coming back towards my direction on the sidewalk. Like I said, I maintained vision of the passenger side and then I seen it again hit the P-Van one more time.

Q. Let's break that down one step at a time. You indicated the vehicle went into reverse, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. Then went up on the sidewalk?

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G.N. 2270

A. Yes. Q. And it went forward and hit the P-Van again, is

that correct? A. Yes. Q. At any time at any point during this time did you

notice any of your fellow officers get out of their vehicles?

A. I don't know how to word it, but -- I don't know how to explain it, but what I'm trying to say was my vision was -- if they were out, I'm not sure at what point they were out.

Q. So you can't really say you saw them at that time?

A. Right. Q. You're focused on the car? A. Right. My vision was on the passenger. Q. The vehicle hits the wall or steel door. Do you

recall if it was a steel door that it hit? A. I'm not sure if it's steel. I know it was like a

metal bar or something. Q. You saw it hit that and then it went forward

again, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. At what point did you discharge your weapon? A. I saw the arm going up and I said gun and I

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G.N. 2271

fired. Q. Again, you had given a command show your hands,

is that correct? A. At that moment? Q. Earlier. A. Earlier I know I said police, don't move, police,

don't move. Q. When you saw the hand come up, did you see

anything in the hand? A. No. To be honest, I didn't see. My thing was

that I wasn't going to wait to see what was coming up. What took place prior with the argument all the way to that led to -- in my mind I felt he had a gun and I felt -- like I said, that was the last thing I wanted to do, but I don't know how to explain because everything -- just my vision was toward him and it felt like everything was a little bit blurry to the side. I don't know how to --

Q. We will continue with a different question. At what point do you discharge your firearm?

A. When I saw the individual Guzman raising his hand like he was motioning, like he was coming up, I said gun.

MR. TESTAGROSSA: Just for the record, Detective Isnora is indicating with a hand motion

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G.N. 2272

with his right hand Mr. Guzman's hand came up from his waist as if he was taking something from

his waistband.Q. Is that correct? A. Yes. Q. At that point do you see that motion, and I will

give it to you in a sequence of collisions. You saw the vehicle hit the P-Van the first time, then hit the wall or the metal bar, as you indicated, then come forward and hit the P-Van again. When is it that you discharge your firearm?

A. After it hits the second time. Q. When it hits the second time? A. I was able to see through the window, the

individual through the passenger side, and, like I said, I saw the arm movement coming up and I yelled gun and --

Q. And that's when you fired? A. Yes. Q. Were you the first person to fire his weapon? A. Yes. Q. How were you holding your weapon when you fired

it? A. I was like almost in a blade stance and my arm

like there. Q. You were holding your firearm with your right arm

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G.N. 2273

extended forward, is that fair to say? A. Yes.

Q. Where did you direct your fire? A. Towards the passenger. Q. At the person you have identified as Guzman? A. Yes. Q. When you fired that first round, did you hear any

glass shattering? A. Yes, I did. Q. Would it be fair to say your first round knocked

out the passenger side window? A. Yes. In the midst of what transpired -- a lot of

times -- I don't know how to explain it, but it felt like I couldn't hear nothing, it was like sketchy. I don't know how to explain, but --

Q. Would it be fair to say you're trying to describe like a kind of tunnel vision where you're focused?

A. Yes. Q. Your first round knocks out that passenger side

window, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. As far as you can recall? A. Yes. Q. How far from the vehicle were you when you fired

that round?

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G.N. 2274

A. It was approximately from here to the chair. Q. You're indicating from where you are in the

witness box to the first row of juror seats? A. Yes, approximately.

MR. TESTAGROSSA: Mr. Foreman, would you say that that's approximately six, seven feet?

FOREPERSON: Give or take a few. Q. After you fired your first round, at that point

had you still seen any of your fellow officers? A. I seen -- I remember Paul Headley, Detective Paul

Headley, being on the left and I remember seeing Carey on the other side, but very vaguely. I'm not too sure exactly the position where they were.

Q. Did you notice them after you fired your first round or was it later in the course of the events that you noticed them?

A. No, it was afterwards. Q. So you noticed them at some point? A. Yes. Q. We will get to that. Now, all together, how many

rounds did you fire? A. I believe it was the eleven rounds that were in

the gun. Q. When you fired your next round, how fast did it

follow after the first round?

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G.N. 2275

A. Everything happened within seconds. Matter of seconds, couple of seconds.

Q. Where did you direct your second round? A. Everything was I was pointed towards the

passenger side of the vehicle. Q. So, again, was this directed at the front

passenger area or at the rear passenger area? A. No, where Mr. Guzman was sitting, front passenger

seat. Q. Once the first round knocked out the window, were

you able to see more clearly into the car? A. I was able to see the individual, but, like I

said, it's sketchy. Like I said, when you have tunnel vision, it's just -- I don't know how to kind of paint the picture to explain that my vision was just solely on this individual and nothing else.

Q. Now, did you fire the rest of your shots all directed in the same area?

A. Yes. Q. All directed in the area of Mr. Guzman? A. Yes. Q. Would it be fair to say that based upon the

action you were taking it was your intention to either kill or disable him at that point?

A. No. My intention was not to kill the individual.

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G.N. 2276

My intention was, as I was trained to shoot center mass and for the -- how do I say -- for the threat to stop.

Q. Center mass is a term for the torso area of the body, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. You're trained to shoot at center mass because

that's where just about all the vital organs are in the body, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. And because shots to center mass would be the

most injurious in all likelihood, is that correct? A. Well, to my summation, like I said -- ask the

question again. Q. I am just saying, you were saying you were aiming

your rounds at center mass because of your training and we are saying that you're trained to shoot at center mass because that's where mainly organs are, is that correct?

A. Well, all the vital organs, yes, are center mass, but that's how we were taught and we were taught to stop the level of threat.

Q. At what point do you observe Detective Oliver out of his vehicle and near you?

A. Well, after the firing had ceased, that's when I noticed he was around my side. Like I said, when I was

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G.N. 2277

firing, I couldn't tell exactly where each individuals were. My tunnel vision blocked everything, all my

peripheral vision. I noticed that afterwards. I seen him, I believe, on my right side of where I was standing.

Q. And you were standing on the passenger side of the Altima, is that correct?

A. Yes. If I was?Q. Yes.A. Yes.Q. And Detective Oliver was to your right. He was

also on the passenger side of the Altima? A. Yes. Q. Just to the right of you? A. Yes. Q. Did you see him firing his weapon into the car? A. After the firing ceased? Q. After your firing ceased. A. After my firing ceased, no. Q. Well, you began the firing, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. When you started firing your weapon, you didn't

see any of your fellow officers at that time, is that correct?

A. All right, how do I paint the picture? I

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G.N. 2278

couldn't pay attention to the surroundings. Like I said, my vision was totally the passenger side. I felt

like the vision around my side was like sketchy, black, and all, like I said -- all I saw was the passenger of the window.

Q. My question is, you started firing first, correct?

A. Yes. Q. And you fired eleven rounds, correct? A. Yes. Q. And you fired them rapidly, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. When you began firing your weapon, your fellow

officers weren't in sight, is that correct? A. You mean if they were around? Q. You didn't know where they were? A. No, I did not. Q. So Detective Oliver was not next to you when you

first fired your weapon, is that correct? A. When I first fired, I did not see him next to me. Q. At some point you noticed Detective Oliver was

next to you, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. You fired your weapon, you emptied your weapon

rapidly, is that correct?

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G.N. 2279

A. Yes. Q. When you finish firing your weapon, is all

gunfire finished at that point? A. To my best recollection, yes, it had ceased. Q. So all of the rounds that were fired by your

fellow officers were fired while you were firing your eleven shots?

A. Honestly, I'm not too sure. I cannot say yes or no, I'm not sure.

Q. When you see Detective Oliver, did you see his weapon in his hand?

A. Yes, I did. I mean if I physically saw the weapon -- I don't know how to put the right answer. I believe he had the weapon in his hand, but for me to actually say where I actually saw it, because like I said, I was -- I don't know -- I was so scared and nervous. All my mind was focused on was the individual in the passenger side. I cannot say for detail what others were doing. If the individual had a gun, I believe he did, but at that point I don't know. It was just afterwards that when it stopped -- I mean, it all happened so quick. It was like -- I mean the details, I cannot actually, you know, spell out the details. Everything happened so quick. I just know very briefly that afterwards I saw Paul on my left and I saw Carey on

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G.N. 2280

the other side and then I saw Detective Oliver on my right side. I'm sorry.

Q. I ask you to look at Grand Jury Exhibit 6. Can you see it from where you are?

A. Yes. Q. Is that a fair representation of where the

vehicles ended up after the P-Van was hit by the Altima the second time?

A. Yes, to my best recollection. Q. Could you with the laser pointer indicate where

you were when you fired your weapon into the vehicle? A. I would say probably around there.

MR. TESTAGROSSA: For the record, the witness has indicated the eastern sidewalk directly across from the Altima.

Q. By the way, were you on the sidewalk or were you in the street?

A. It was over here. This is where I was. I was on the sidewalk.

Q. You were on the sidewalk? A. Yes. Q. When you saw Detective Oliver, where was he when

you first saw him? A. After the firing had ceased, I noticed him in

this area here.

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G.N. 2281

Q. Approximately the same area you were? A. Yes, but to my right.

Q. So maybe a little further north of you? A. I guess maybe from where he is sitting. Q. You're indicating about three feet away from him? A. Yes. Q. Where was Police Officer Carey when you saw him? A. He was on the other side. Q. You're indicating with the laser pointer on Grand

Jury Exhibit 6 that he was on the passenger side of the P-Van or the driver's side of the Altima, is that correct?

A. Yes, he was in that neighborhood. Q. Did you see Detective Cooper at that time? A. I didn't see him, no. Q. When you saw Officer Carey, did he have his

firearm in his hand? A. Like I said, I didn't pay attention. Most likely

he did have the firearm in his hand, but I didn't see it.

Q. Did you notice if either of the other officers who you have indicated, Carey or Oliver, had shields at that time?

A. I did not notice, I cannot say. Q. Now, you indicated that you saw Mr. Benefield, is

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G.N. 2282

that correct? A. Yes.

Q. Had you seen him get out of the vehicle? A. Yes. Q. Again, can you just show the Members of the Grand

Jury where you saw him go? A. On that board he was running towards 95th. Q. So he was running south of Liverpool Street as

you're indicating with the laser pointer on Grand Jury 1 towards 95th Avenue, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. Do you remember if he was on the sidewalk or not? A. He was on the sidewalk. Q. Who did you see running next to him or after him? A. I noticed Detective Headley chasing after

Benefield and once he chased after him, I followed behind him.

Q. You indicated that Mr. Benefield went to the ground, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. I believe you stated in your narrative that

Detective Headley grabbed him, is that correct? A. Yes. I was behind Paul Headley and I think he

tried to -- while he was running, I guess he kind of grabbed him on the jacket and he went to the ground.

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G.N. 2283

Q. Are you certain that Detective Headley grabbed him and that he went to the ground or might he just have

gone to the ground without Detective Headley touching him?

A. No. I believe he had grabbed him to stop him from actually running.

Q. When Mr. Benefield was running down the street, did you notice if he was limping?

A. No, because I cannot say. Honestly, I can't say. Q. So is it that you don't recall whether he was

limping or you don't think he was limping? A. I don't recall if he was. I just noticed when he

was running and Detective Paul Headley was running behind him, I ran behind Paul Headley.

Q. Going back again to when you were firing at the Altima, you indicated that you were firing at the passenger side. Were you alongside the passenger side of the vehicle or were you towards the front of the vehicle?

A. No, I was along the passenger side of the vehicle.

Q. So were your rounds being directed like into the front passenger area of the vehicle and kind of straight across the vehicle or were they diagonal from the passenger side front to the driver's side rear?

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G.N. 2284

A. My best recollection is that it went from -- it went straight, I believe, into the front passenger side.

Q. So then if I understand you correctly, your rounds would have traveled straight across the front passenger compartment passenger side to the driver's side?

A. Yes, that's my best recollection. Q. You emptied all of your rounds, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. By the way, did you have any additional magazines

with you that night? A. No. Q. You had the one magazine? A. Yes. Q. Now, ultimately you dropped the magazine from

your weapon, is that correct? A. Yes, ultimately I did. Q. To release the magazine from your weapon, you

have to press a magazine release, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. And you have to adjust your hand position on the

weapon to be able to reach the magazine release, is that correct?

A. No, you don't have to. It was just -- it's like a light squeeze. There is a button, I believe, by the

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G.N. 2285

thumb area. Q. Can you reach in the same grip that you use to

fire the weapon, are you able to extend your thumb far enough to reach the magazine release without adjusting your hand?

A. Yes. Q. What was your purpose in releasing the magazine? A. No purpose at all. At the range a lot of times

while we are shooting we press the magazine and it drops.

Q. And that's for the purpose of putting another magazine in, is that correct, when you're at the range?

A. Most cases, yes. Q. When your firearm had been totally discharged and

you released the magazine, what position was the slide in on your firearm?

A. It automatically -- once the rounds are finished, it automatically slides back.

Q. And it locks in that position, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. What did you do with your firearm when was it was

in that position? Did you ever release the slide? A. No. I simply -- you know, I simply put it in my

sweater. Q. So you put it in your sweater with the slide

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G.N. 2286

locked in the rear position, is that correct? A. Yes.

Q. That's where it ended up when you discharged all of your ammunition, is that correct?

A. Yes. Once the fire had ceased and, like I said, when Paul Headley went to chase after the individual, I put the weapon in my sweater.

Q. When you went down the block to where Mr. Benefield was, did you stay in the area where Mr. Benefield was for any length of time?

A. Yes. I stayed with Detective Paul Headley and he notified -- he called for an ambulance and several other units.

Q. Were you present when the ambulance came and retrieved Mr. Benefield?

A. Yes. Q. Do you recall whether you assisted in putting

Mr. Benefield on a stretcher? A. No. Q. Do you recall just touching Mr. Benefield at that

point where he was down the block? A. No. Q. Now, after the events were over, there came a

time when your weapon was retrieved by a sergeant, is that correct?

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G.N. 2287

A. Yes. Q. Do you recall whether your weapon was in that

position with the slide back when you gave it to the sergeant?

A. Yes. Q. That was the way you gave it to him? A. Yes. Q. Do you remember what sergeant it was that you

gave it to? A. No, I don't remember his name. Q. Another thing that you indicated was that during

the course of the incident you had been hit by the vehicle as it had gone forward, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. And you had gotten an injury to your right leg,

is that correct? A. Yes. Q. I am going to ask you to look at Exhibit 16A-11

and ask you if you recognize that? A. Yes. Q. Is that a fair depiction of the injury that you

had received that day? A. Yes. Q. I am going to ask you to look at a couple of

other photographs. 32A(48)-41. Again, I am going to

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G.N. 2288

ask you if you recognize that?MR. TESTAGROSSA: Perhaps you could bring

that up a little closer. Q. Do you recognize that, Detective? A. Yes. Q. Does that also depict the injury you had

sustained that night? A. Yes. Q. Finally, just one other photo of that. That

would be 32A(49)-42. Again, does that photo accurately depict the injury you sustained?

A. Yes. Q. After the events were over, you were brought to a

hospital, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. Which hospital did you go to? A. I remember the second time was Booth Memorial

Hospital. I don't remember the name of the hospital. Q. Would it be fair to say that you went to two

hospitals? A. Yes. Q. Do you know if the first one was North Shore

University Hospital? A. Yes. Q. And that one you went to in the early morning

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G.N. 2289

hours, would that be fair to say? A. Yes.

Q. Did you receive treatment there? A. Yes. Q. Do you recall what the treatment was that you

received? A. Basically took X-rays. Q. Then you were released, is that correct? A. Yes. Q. There was no fracture, is that correct? A. No. Q. Later on you went back to a different hospital,

is that correct? A. Yes. Q. Which hospital was that? A. I believe Booth Memorial.

MR. TESTAGROSSA: At this time pursuant to Detective Isnora's testimony being treated at two hospitals we are going to offer into evidence as Grand Jury Exhibit 61A a document which is entitled at the top North Shore L.I.J. North Shore University Hospital, 300 Community Drive, Manhasset, New York 11030. Telephone (516) 562-0100. There's a certification. I, Elizabeth Heller, Director Health Information Management of

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G.N. 2290

North Shore University Hospital, 300 Community Drive, Manhasset, New York, hereby certify that

the record attached is in the custody of and is the full and complete record of the condition, act, transaction, occurrence or event of this institution concerning patient name and it has Gescard Isnora, medical record number 40146941. I further certify that the record was made in the regular course of business of this institution and it is the regular course of business of this institution to make such record and such record is made at the time of the condition, act, transaction, occurrence or event or within a reasonable time thereafter and it's signed Elizabeth Heller, Director Health Information Management.

We will offer that into evidence pursuant to its certification and Civil Practice Law and Rule 45.18. That would be Exhibit 61A.

We are going to offer also into evidence pursuant to Detective Isnora's testimony a document entitled New York Hospital Queens 56-45 Main Street, Flushing, New York 11355. Telephone (718) 670-1231. WWW/NYH2.org. Dated 3/6/07. To whom it may concern: This is to certify that the

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G.N. 2291

attached record is a true Xerox microfilm of the original record currently available and

maintained in the Health Information Management Department of the New York Hospital Queens of Gescard Isnora for the period of 11/25/06 emergency report. That this record was made in the regular course of business of this hospital and that it was the regular course of business of this hospital to make such record and that such record was made at the time of the condition, act, transaction, occurrence or event or within a reasonable time thereafter. It's signed respectfully Karen Meteron, MHA, RHIT, Director Health Information Management Department.

Again, we are offering this into evidence as Exhibit 61B pursuant to its certification and Civil Practice Law and Rule section 45.18.

Now, if I can have a moment and see if there are any other matters for us to cover.

Q. Just a couple of questions. Going back to when you were firing your weapon, you indicated after the first shot that the window was blown out of the vehicle, is that correct, the passenger side front window?

A. Yes. Right after the first shot, everything was all consecutive.

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G.N. 2292

Q. After that time could you see into the vehicle? A. Yes. I was able to see -- I don't understand.

Q. Could you see the occupants in the vehicle through the window that was no longer there?

A. Yes. Q. And you saw Mr. Guzman, is that correct, through

that window? A. Yes. I saw the individual as -- even before when

I maintained the vision of the passenger and when the window was shattered.

Q. Did you at any point while you were firing your weapon see Mr. Guzman trying to escape across the front seat to the driver's side?

A. No, I can't tell. The only thing I can say was in my mind he was going to his waistband, he was coming up.

Q. So you never did see if Mr. Guzman was trying to evade the gunfire, for example?

A. Meaning if I can tell or -- Q. Yes. If you saw movement in the car which you

concluded he was trying to escape being hit by your gunfire?

A. No. Q. What was it that you could see him doing or what

was it you saw him doing as you were firing your weapon?

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G.N. 2293

A. Well, my mind everything happened so quick. The only thing I remember was that his arm movement was

going up and his hand was going up and as I fired away, that's pretty much what I remember.

Q. That was the movement you saw before you had fired your weapon, is that correct? That's the movement you saw that led you to fire your weapon?

A. Yes. Q. What movement did you see after you began to fire

your weapon? A. I just saw the muzzle flash. I just couldn't

tell. Q. Did you at any point realize that there did not

appear to be gunshots coming from that vehicle? A. I'm not sure. I mean -- can you repeat the

question? Q. Did you at any point realize that there was no

threat coming from inside the vehicle? A. I could not tell. Q. Did you ever pause in your gunfire to assess

whether there was a threat coming from inside the vehicle?

A. No, because I was so scared and in my mind as to what happened before all the way up to that point, like I said, tunnel vision I just couldn't. I wasn't able to

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G.N. 2294

-- MR. TESTAGROSSA: I have no further

questions for Detective Isnora. Do any members of the jury have any questions?

JUROR: He said when he came to the passenger side of the vehicle he said police, don't move, et cetera. If he is yelling that, how can they hear because he said the windows are closed and he is yelling police, don't move?

MR. TESTAGROSSA: He can't say why they don't answer, but I can --

JUROR: How could they hear? Q. A juror has a question. As you approach the

vehicle, the Altima, the windows are closed on the Altima, correct?

A. Yes, I believe so. Q. As a matter of fact, the fired rounds blew out

the passenger side window, the window on Guzman's side, is that correct?

A. Yes. Q. The juror's question is how could the occupants

of the vehicle hear you through closed windows as you were shouting commands to them?

A. How could they hear me? Q. Yes. Were you yelling in a loud manner?

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G.N. 2295

A. Yes, I was screaming. JUROR: Is it possible that he used his seat

belt, and one other question, did he ever tell the Lieutenant about he was suspicious of the SUV guy?

MR. TESTAGROSSA: I can't ask the first one because I can't really go through what's possible. I will ask the second question which was again --

JUROR: Did he ever tell the Lieutenant he was suspicious of the SUV man?

Q. A juror asks if after the observations you made of the man with the SUV and his hands in his pocket, if you ever communicated to the Lieutenant that you were suspicious of that man and the possibility that he might have a weapon?

A. I did not, no. JUROR: When he fired the first shot at

Mr. Guzman and it went through the window and there was no shooting coming back, why did he keep firing on the passenger side?

Q. A juror asks, when you fired your first shot at Mr. Guzman and you didn't hear any return fire, what was the reason that you continued to fire at Mr. Guzman?

A. Like I had said, everything happened so quick.

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G.N. 2296

It was a matter of seconds that all the rounds just went -- it's not something that -- I cannot even explain it.

Like I said, I had tunnel vision and after the first round everything was so continuous afterwards. Everything was continuous afterwards.

JUROR: Did he see the lieutenant's car pass by and if he did, why didn't he wait for him?

Q. A juror asks, as you approached the Altima, did you see the lieutenant's vehicle pass by?

A. Before I even approached the vehicle, I noticed the car of the Lieutenant speed past me. It overshot me. After I crossed the corner of the street, it just zoomed right by me. The car had overshot me and I kind of indicated that was the car right there, the car where the individual was, and they had overshot me, already past me.

Q. The second part of the juror's question was, since you did notice the lieutenant's car go past you, why didn't you wait for the Lieutenant and the assistance of your fellow officers could provide before you took the action you took?

A. Well, as an undercover many times with the field team members are there, but they are several blocks away and, like I said, things happened so quick that by the time the field team members end up there, it's already

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G.N. 2297

too late and I felt that when the supervisor's vehicle had passed, I thought these guys are going to come and

shoot out and do the drive-by by the club so I felt I had to intercede.

JUROR: When he was at the club and there was nothing happening at the club, right, and he never had his badge on, why did he wait until he passed the guys to put his badge on? He could have had it out. Why wait until they pass?

MR. TESTAGROSSA: Let me see if I got that. Why did he put on his shield and cover up and instead of waiting?

JUROR: Right. Q. A juror asks with reference to taking out your

shield and putting it on your collar as you indicated. The question was, why did you put it on, I guess, in the middle of the block on 94th Avenue before you got to the corner and then have to cover it up as you walked by people rather than waiting a little bit longer to just put it on when you got to Liverpool Street?

A. Well, the reason I did that even before I reached the corner I covered it up because I didn't want the individual on the corner to tip off their friends and as soon as I passed them, I then dropped my hand and reached for my weapon so that they were able to see my

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G.N. 2298

shield which was on my collar. Q. Again, you had indicated just a moment ago when

we were talking about the Lieutenant's Camry that you made a signal. What was the signal you made?

A. Basically my head pointing towards the car. Q. A head nod, I believe, you indicated? A. Yes.

MR. TESTAGROSSA: For the record, the witness had tilted his head toward the left and made a nodding movement.

JUROR: What made him feel unsafe in the club to call Cooper?

Q. A juror asks, going back to the period of time when you were in the club, you had indicated that you called Detective Cooper shortly after you got there because you felt uncomfortable, is that correct?

A. Yes. Usually when I go into a location, I usually prefer that at least two people are present there.

Q. Was there something in particular you could point to that was making you feel uneasy when you were sitting in the club that led to you calling Detective Cooper?

A. Honestly, there was nothing in particular. It was just that for safety I felt comfortable with him being there.

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G.N. 2299

Q. Would that be, generally speaking, you prefer to have the company of a couple of other ghosts or

undercovers with you? A. Yes. Q. But it wasn't anything specific happening in the

club? A. No.

JUROR: Did it ever occur to him that these guys in the Altima could have confused him with the same threat with the SUV guy?

Q. A juror asks if it occurred to you at any point that the people in the Altima who you were approaching could have considered you to be connected to the man with the SUV who they had had the run in with?

A. Honestly, I could not tell you what they were thinking.

Q. This was more a question of whether it occurred to you that they might consider you part of the threat that that man posed?

A. It could have, but I am pretty sure that the distance from where I was to where I was you could see my shield.

JUROR: When he entered the club that afternoon and he went inside, did he ever hear there was going to be a bachelor party?

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G.N. 2300

MR. TESTAGROSSA: I will ask him about whether he heard anything about that.

Q. A juror asks if during the time that you were in the Kalua Club that night you ever learned that a bachelor party was also going on at the same time?

A. No. The minute I got there I thought this is just a regular Friday night. It's usually packed on Friday and Saturday night.

JUROR: When he was standing outside the club by the SUV, did he hear anyone mention that I am from Rockaway or Georgia?

Q. A juror asks, when you were standing outside the club and you saw the encounter between the group of men and the man with the SUV, did you hear anybody mention that they were from Far Rockaway?

A. No. No, I didn't hear that.JUROR: At any point during his tunnel

vision with Guzman while Guzman was in the car, did he see any eye contact that he had actually noticed that Guzman had noticed him and possibly seen his badge?

MR. TESTAGROSSA: The second part I can ask about whether he seemed to notice him, but that would be a little too specific for this witness to say what another person observed.

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G.N. 2301

Q. A juror asks, as you approached the Altima and are, I guess, in front of it and then alongside of it,

did you see any indication from Mr. Guzman by, I guess, any movement or whatever that he may have engaged in that he saw you and knew you were there?

A. Yes. I got to the front of the vehicle, I maintained eye contact with both individuals in the car. I wanted to see what they were doing. For all I knew, they could have just, you know, put up their arms and shot me right there.

Q. When you say eye contact, you're looking at their eyes. Can you tell whether they are looking at your eyes? The juror is asking if there was something that they did that indicated that they saw you, something that they did to indicate that they actually knew you were there?

A. Yes, they were both looking at me. JUROR: When he was inside the thing, did he

see who the girl was pointing out? MR. TESTAGROSSA: You're talking about the

man with the White Sox hat? JUROR: Yes, and where was Sanchez when he

was following the group? Q. Two questions. When you went down the block

following the group of men after the encounter with the

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G.N. 2302

SUV man, do you know where Detective Sanchez was at that point?

A. No, I did not because my attention was towards the group and I am not going to assume where Detective Sanchez -- basically, I did not see where he was. He was behind me and that's all I know.

Q. Was the last place you saw him, at least for that period of time, where you were standing outside the club?

A. When I last saw him, yes. Q. So, in other words, you walked away from him and

as far as you know, he remained in that area? A. Yes.

MR. TESTAGROSSA: I forgot the second one. JUROR: The girl inside the club, did he see

the guy that she pointed out when they was having an argument and the guy --

MR. TESTAGROSSA: I am going to bring him back to that and let him retell that.

Q. A juror is asking you if you could go back to the time when you are in the club and you were at the bar and the woman was having a conversation with the man with the White Sox hat. Do you recall that part of your testimony?

A. Yes.

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G.N. 2304

radio with you at that time? A. No, I didn't have a radio. I had my cell phone

on me, but not a radio. Q. You had the cell phone, but you did not

communicate with the Lieutenant at that point about a description of who you were following, would that be fair to say?

A. On my cell phone, no. I did not use my cell phone. I had Detective Sanchez', he was on his phone so he then passed me the phone. That's when I --

Q. When you went to the corner, did you have Detective Sanchez' cell phone or your own or two phones?

A. No, I had my phone on my -- when I got to the corner, I wasn't using a cell phone. You mean when I'm following the individuals?

Q. Yes. A. No, I didn't have no phone on me. Q. That had been Detective Sanchez' phone? A. Yes.

JUROR: When the fellow was running down the block, did he draw his weapon and shoot him in the leg?

Q. A juror asks, when you saw Trent Benefield running down Liverpool Street as you indicated, did you fire your weapon at him?

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G.N. 2305

A. No, I did not. JUROR: When he said he was walking towards

the car with his gun out, if he felt threatened why didn't he try to find cover instead of shooting?

Q. A juror asks that as you approached the vehicle with Mr. Guzman, if it was your concern that Mr. Guzman might retrieve a weapon while inside that vehicle, why did you not take cover rather than put yourself directly in front of the vehicle?

A. Well, if there was cover to be taken, I would have taken it. I had the wall behind me. It was like a wide open space. Where else could I go? By that time if he wanted to get out and shoot, he would have.

Q. Well, there were other parked cars on the block, weren't there?

A. Yes, but they were further down towards the end. Q. So are you indicating that there were no other

cars parked on the east side of Liverpool Street at that time?

A. From where I was to where the car was, there was a distance I would have to run but by that time --

Q. There were other parked cars on the side of the street, is that correct?

A. Yes.

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G.N. 2306

Q. And cover can be cars but it can also be light posts as well, is that correct?

A. Yes. JUROR: Did he hear any other police

officers giving warning shouts to the Altima? Q. A jurors asks if you heard any of your fellow

officers shouting any commands at the Altima? A. To be honest with you, I couldn't hear because,

like I said, usually when you have tunnel vision -- for me everything seemed so quiet and everything was so fast. I can't say if someone was shouting commands.

MR. TESTAGROSSA: Detective Isnora, it appears that there are no further questions for you. Thank you.

(WITNESS EXCUSED)

MR. REESE: That concludes today's testimony. Please don't discuss the case until you have heard all the evidence in the case and we have had a chance to charge you on the law. Thank you.