Þ & ffi ffi i*. UNÏTED STATES DTSTRTCT. COURT NORTHERN DTSTRTCT OF CALIFORNIA RUSSEI-L ALLEN NORDYKE, et al., PlainÈiffs, vs. MARY V. KING, et a1., , Defendants. : DEPOSTTTON OF NOVEMBER 3, 2005, REPORTEÐ BY: HOLLY D. No. CV-99 -04389-M,l,l 251 'üI. Jaclcson Street 505 W. Whittier Ave. Sonor4Ca95370 Tncy,Cø-95376 CENTRAL CALIFORNIA REPORTERS Certifïed Shorthand and Video Reporters 516 rtr. Shaw Ave., Ste. 200 300 J St¡eet, Ste 200 Fresno, Ca" 93704 Sacramento, Ca 9581 Telephone; (209) .532-9352 Fax (209) 532,.9362 üËfrfiF|Ëf fifipy RÏCi( K. PICKERTNG PLEASANTON, CALIFORNIA HENSYEL, C.S.R. NO. l_0508 (800) s4v-2r8s
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Þ
&ffiffi
i*.
UNÏTED STATES DTSTRTCT. COURT
NORTHERN DTSTRTCT OF CALIFORNIA
RUSSEI-L ALLEN NORDYKE, et al . ,
Pla inÈ i f f s ,
v s .
MARY V. K ING, e t a1 . ,
, Defendants.
:DEPOSTTTON OF
NOVEMBER 3, 2005,
REPORTEÐ BY: HOLLY D.
No. CV-99 -04389-M, l , l
251 'üI. Jaclcson Street 505 W. Whittier Ave.Sonor4Ca95370 Tncy,Cø-95376
CENTRAL CALIFORNIA REPORTERSCertifïed Shorthand and Video Reporters
516 rtr. Shaw Ave., Ste. 200 300 J St¡eet, Ste 200Fresno, Ca" 93704 Sacramento, Ca 9581
Telephone; (209) .532-9352 Fax (209) 532,.9362
üËfrfiF|Ëff fifipyRÏCi( K. PICKERTNG
PLEASANTON, CALIFORNIA
H E N S Y E L , C . S . R . N O . l _ 0 5 0 8
(800) s4v-2r8s
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APPEARANCES
For P1aín t i f f s :
DONALD E. . f . KILMER, JR.
LAW OFFICES OF DONALD E.J. KILMER, ,JR.
126l Lincoln Avenue, Suite L11_
San , .Tose, CA 9S12S
For Defendants:
T. PETER PIERCE
LAV'T OFFICES OF RICHARDS, V,TATSON & GERSHON
355 South Grand Avenue, 40th Floor
Los Ange les , CA 9007 i - -3101
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ÏNDEX
l/[ïTNESS
RICK K. PTCKERTNG
EXAMINATTON
BY MR. PTERCE
BY MR. KTLMER
N o .
i-
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Page
EXHTBTT INDEX
Descript. ion
Letter to Richard K. pickering from
Richard E. Wínnie dated August 23,
]-999 5
52 Ordinance No. O-ZOOO-]_1
3 Letter to T & S Trade Show from
Rick pickering dated Septembet 7,
l . 9 9 9
4 Ord inance No . O-2OOO-22
5 Lett.er to Rick pickering from
Donald E. ,f . Ki lmer, ,Jr., dated.
Oc tobe r 20 , l 99g
6 Letter to T & S Trade Shows from
Terri Eagan Thut dated January 5,
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N o .
7
EXHIBIT INDEX (Cont inued) . . .
Descript ion
Letter to Richard Pickerinq from
Dona1d E . . ï . K i lmer , J r . , daÈed
February 25, 2005
Let . ter to Donald E. ,J . K i lmer , J t . ,
from Rick Pickering dated Marc}a 22,
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Packet of letters
Invoice dated l0 /3I /gg
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BE ïT REMEMBERED that pursuant to NOTICE and on
NOVEMBER 3, 2005, ât the hour of l -0 :05 a.m. at the
ALAMEDA COUNTY FAIRGROUNDS, 450L pleasanton Avenue,
Pleasanton, Cali fornia, personally appeared before me,
HOLLY D. HENSYEL, a Certified Shorthand Reporter for the
St.ate of Ca1ífornia,
RICK K. PICKERING,
a deponent herein, who, being first duly affirmed, \^ras
thereupon examíned and Èestif ied as hereinafter set
for th :
(Exhíbíts L through I marked for
Ídent i f icat ion. )
EXATVITNATION
BY MR. PIERCE:
O. Good morning, Mr. pickering. Could you state
and speIl your fuII name for the record?
A. Rick K. P icker ing, R- i -c-k , and then the le t ter
K . , P - i - c - k - e - r - i - n - 9 .
O. We're here for your deposit ion today in the
case involving Alameda County's ordinance, whích bans
the possession of f irearms on County-owned. property.
I 'm going to ask you some guestions and I think
Mr. Kilmer is going to have some guestj-ons for you as
weII. Are you employed, sir?
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A . Y e s , I a m .
O. Vüho is your employer?
A. The Alameda County Agricultural Fair
Associat ion.
O. What is your t i t le?
A. Chief Execut ive Of f icer .
O. How long have you been the CEO?
A. Since January 4, L999.
O. Cou1d you brief ly describe your duties?
A. I am the sole employee of the Board of
Directors under long-term contracE responsible for the
operations and finances and upkeep of the property and
all of the programs produced here on the property, all
of the subleases that exist and I report directly to a
Board of 26 individuals and we are a nonprofit 5OLC3
corporation.
O. Do you recalI ín 1999 learning that Alameda
County had adopted an ordinance prohibiting the
possession of f irearms on County property?
A . Y e s .
O. I 'd l ike to refer you to Exhibí t L , which has
been premarked, and I,m handing a copy of that to
Mr . K i lmer .
I 'd l ike you just to read that le t ter , i f you
cou ld , p lease .
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A. Okay.
O. What is this document, sir?
A. This is a letter from Chief Countv Counsel
Richard Winnie to myself.
O. Do you recaII receiving this letter?
A . Y e s , I d o .
O. I would now l ike to show you what,s been
premarked as Exhibit No. 2. I belíeve vou have it
there , Lf you could take a look at t.hat document.
A. Okay.
o .
A .
WhaL is Exhibit No. 2?
ft appears to be
referred to in the August
O. Okay, thank you.
Èhat was attached weII,
that you receíved from Mr.
the County's ordÍnance that is
2 3 , ' 9 9 l e t t e r .
And that was the ordinance
v/as it att.ached to the lett.er
; - .wt_nnr_e ?
A . Yes , i t . was .
O. Do you recall after receÍving this letter from
Mr. rrlinníe with the attached ordinance writinq a letter
to the Nordykes asking them t,o show how they would
conduct Lheir trade show in compliance with the
ordínance?
A . Y e s .
O. I 'd l ike to show you what ,s been premarked as
Exhib i t 3 . I 'm handing a copy to Mr. K i lmer . I f you
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could take a look at Exhibit 3 and
Lrs, p lease?
then identify i t for
A. This is a copy of a letter dated September Z,
'99 from myself to T & S Trade Shows, Russ and Sa1lie
Nordyke.
O. Could you please read the third paragraph of
Lhe letter, the second sentence of the third paragraph
of the letter?
A. 'twith regards to the potential of a November
gun show, T & S Trade Show must provide the AssociatÍon
wi th a wr i t ten p lan by October 1_5th, tggg, âs to how i t
will conduct the gun show at the Alameda County
Fairgrounds and comply with Ordinance No . O-2OOO-LL., '
O. What prompted you to write this letter?
A. The letter from County Counsel. Let me back
up. The August 23, ,99 letter from County Counsel.
O. Why were you asking the T & S Trade Shows to
provide an explanation as Lo how they would cond.uct a
gun show or a trade show on County property?
A. The second paragraph of Mr. Winnie,s Augustr 23,
'99 letter stated that the ordínance would take effect
on September l -6 th, Lggg.
He then referenced the operating agreement
between the Fair Association and the county of Alameda,
Sectíon L5, that states, r 'The Fairgrounds must be
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operated in compliance with al l applicable laws, codes,
regulations and ordinances, including the attached
ordinance,rr which referred to the gun show ordinance.
Therefore, I attached the gun show ordinance in
my letLer to the Nord.ykes and asked for a plan as to how
they would comply with this ordinance.
O. Prior to writ ing the lett,er to the Nordykes on
September the 7tr}r, 1999, had you ever received. any
indication from the Nordykes or their Iega1 counsel that
they were not going Èo be able to comply with the
ordinance?
A . Y e s .
O. Vüas that also ín part what prompted you to
wrÍte the letter of September 7th, l-ggg?
A . Y e s .
O. Do you recalI a few weeks after you wrote this
letter of September 7E]n, L999, that the County amend.ed
its ordinance by addíng an exception to the ban on
firearms possession on County property?
A . Yes
O, And how díd you come to learn about the amended
ordinance?
A. Scott ish Caledonian Games approached us
indicating that they üzeren,t sure i f they could comply
with this ordinance.2 5
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I sent them to the County of Alameda and said,
rtYou need to have that discussion with County Counsel
and the Sherif f ' s Deþartment. 'r
The result of those discussions came back, to
with an amendment to themy understanding, came back
ordinance which would allow
certain circumstances .
possessíon of f irearms under
In the case of the ScotÈish games, i t would
al1ow them to do a historical reenactment provided
certain safeguards were in place.
O. Did the County forward a copy of the amended
ordinance to you at some point?
A . Y e s .
O. I 'd l ike you to take a look at what 's been
premarked as Exhibit 4. f 'm handing a copy to
Mr. K i lmer .
A. Okay. I 've rev iewed i t .
O. V ' Ihat is Exhib i t No. 4 , s í r?
A . Exh íb i t No . 4 i s Ord inance O-2Ooo-22 , wh ich
appears to be ít states that i t 's amending the prior
ordinance.
O. Is this the amended ordinance that you received
from t,he County?
A .
o .
I be l i eve i t i s , yes .
Now, at the time this amended ordinance hras
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adopted, what events had taken place at the Faírgrounds
where firearms were present? Any events in the past
where f irearms were present?
A. fs your question between when I came on in
,Tanuary of '99 through when this ordÍnance was amended?
O. Let 's I ími t i t to that t ime for purposes of Lhe
quest ion.
A. I bel ieve there had been two gun shows,
possibly the September gun show. We had the August
Scott, ish Caledonian Games. I 'm not sure how thaÈ date
faIls within this amendment..
0. Let me fo1Iow-up with t.he Scott ish g'ames . Had
you ever personally observed the Scott ish games?
A. Not at th is fac i l i ty .
O. Had you personally observed them at some other
fac i l i tv?
A. Yes, a smaller version of the Scott ish games is
conducted at the Orange County Fairgrounds in Costa
Mesa, Cal i forn ia
O. When did you observe those?
A. I was the Deputy General Manager at the Orange
County Fairgrounds for five years, so I obserwed them
for f ive years.
a .
A .
What is the main t,hrust of thaÈ event?
The Scott ish Caledonian Games?
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O . Y e s , s í r .
A. Tt 's been termed as the largest gathering of
Scotsmen outside of Scot1and. They consider i t the
eguívalent of the ScotÈÍsh O1ympics, so heawy weights,
weightl i f t ing, weight throwing, Èossing the caber,
bagpipes, Scot t ish Highland 'dancing, f íve-on-a-s ide
soccer tour:naments, darts, híst.orical reenactments,
historical vi l Iage, the garb that goes with the Scott ish
clans that are here.
They bring in some Brit ish automobiles l ike the
MG's and the MG Midgets. Normally, there is a pageantry
display, a parade of people in costume, swords, knives.
Scot t ish garb is for sa le, Scot t ish food is for sa1e,
ethnic food. pert inent to the Scots specif ical ly
There are normally dignitaries associated with
the event such as Scottísh Ambassadors, Brit ish
Ambassadors, míl i tary personnel. There is normally a
Grand Marshal dignitary. This last year it was Colonel
Doty, an Army colonel, from Camp parks. There are
normally batt le scene reenactments, whether i t ,s swords
and. knives or f irearms.
O. Okay. Does t,he Scott ish games conduct their
events at the Alameda County Fairgrounds now?
A. Yes, each August .
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O. Every August?
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A. Every August.
O. And that ,s s t i l l ongoing?
A. Correct , .
O. Are f irearms used in the hístorical
reenactments?
A. They are.
O. Is there, to your knowledge, any restr ict. ion on
the use of f irearms?
A. Yes , t he re i s .
0. What are those?
A. The restr ict ions outl ined in the ordinance, al l
of the firearms have to have certain care and custody.
lVe turn that matter over to the Pleasanton police
Department and the Alameda CounÈy Sheriff Department for
review
The care and custody of those firearms, they
are to keep them under lock and key until such time as
they are brought out for the historical reenactment.
They are then supposed to go back under lock and key and
they are f ir ing only blanks.
O. .A,re only those individuals who are authorized
part icipants in the Scott ish games al lowed to handle or
possess the f irearms during these hist.orical
reenactments?
A. We've provided the organizers of the ScoÈtish
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Caledonian Games with a copy of the ordinance for them
t.o comply wíth as well as we provide the ordinance to
the Pleasanton Police Department and Countv Sheriff ,s
Department.
O. When the Scott ish games came to you after this
ordinance, after Alameda County, s ordinance had been
adopr-ed in its original form, did you telI them that
they needed to explaín how they were going to comply
vüíth the ordinance?
A. lle told them that unless the ordinance was
ihanged., they would have to provide us with a plan as to
how they could comply with the ordinance
O. Have you ever heard of an event ca1Ied an
Outdoor & Sportsmen's Show?
A. tüe have an International Outdoor & Sportsmen, s
Show.
O. When you say you have it, does that mean they
conducÈ shows on the fairgrounds, Alameda County
Fairgrounds?
A. They have for the past several years. They
have cancel led the i r show for 2006.
O. And before the 2006 cancellatÍon, were they
conductÍng a show annually on the Faírgrounds?
A. Yes, roughly February of each lear; February or
March.
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O. And have you ever personally observed an
Outdoor & Sportsmen,s Show on the Alameda County
Fairgrounds?
A. Each year sínce they came to the Fairground.s,
which may have been 20Oi- or 2002.
O. And what is the maÍn thrust of an Outdoor &
Spor tsmen's Show?
A. The show that takes place here is d.i f ferent
than Èhe show that takes place in San Mateo, which is
t,heír very large show in San Mateo.
The show j-n San Mateo includes firearms r
ammunÍt ion, reloading material, gun leather holsters, êt
cetera, hunting tr ips, travel guides, f ishing, gaming,
f ishing tríps, boats, f ishingi gear, materials and.
supplíes for hunting and f ishing.
When the show leaves San Mateo and then
to Pleasanton, that show is not allowed to have
as described in this ordinance or ammunition as
described in t,his ordinance, so i t is a símiIar
San Mateo wiLh the exception of no f irearms or
moves
firearms
show as
ammunition, so there are hunting components, travel
hunting opportunit ies, boating components, f ishing
components, adventure tríps for fishing and hunting and
then the relaÈed materials and supplies.
O. Have you ever seen a firearm on the Alameda
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County Fairgrounds during an Outdoor & Sportsmen's Show?
A. Not as defined by this ordinance.
O. Have you seen a f irearm outsíde of the
definit ion of f irearms within the ordinance?
A. We have seen instruments that we have
guestioned whether they are consídered a firearm or not
as descri-bed by thís ordinance.
O. What sort of instruments?
A. Specif ical ly, the International Sportsmen's
that onShow brought in a paínt ball gun and had
dísplay, I bel ieve, on a mannegui-n.
O . okay .
A. And the vendor was a vendor that owned a paint
ball practice range in either the Fremont or San ,Jose
area and t.hey v\¡ere sel l ing either a 910 or gL5 coupon
for people to go down to their range and engage in paint
ball activit ies, but the paint ball gun was not for
sale, and the ammunition was not for sale, meaning the
plast ic pa int ba1ls .
The other i tem that was referred Lo us for
consideration as to whether it was a firearm under the
terms of the ordínance, Internatíona1 Sportsmen, s Show
brought in members of the NRÄ, set up paper targets and
were us ing e i ther spr ing or a Í r propel led sof t peI le ts ,
which are a small plastic peIIet that pierced the paper
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target
In both of those incidents, we contacÈed
Lieutenant Knutsen, Lhe Alameda County Sheriff 's
Department, and asked for Sheriff 's interpretation as to
whet,her Lhose implements were encompassed in this
ordinance or whether the Sheriff believed t,hev were
exempted by this ordinance.
O. And whaÈ was the conclusion?
A .
o .
That they vüere exempted by the ordinance.
I just want to refer you to the ordinance,
Exhibit 4, Paragraph D, whích seLs forth the definit ion
of a f i rearm.
It says, rrFirearm is any g'un, pistol, revolver,
r i f le or any device, designed or modifíed to be used as
a weapon, from which j-s expelled through a barrel a
projecti le by Èhe force of an explosion or other form of
combustion. r '
This paint ball r i f le you referred to, was that
ríf1e the barrel through which is expelled a projecti le
by the force of combustíon or explosion?
A. ï t is compressed a i r .
O. So is the answer to the question no?
A. According to Lieutenant Knutsen, the answer
would be twofold. One is that i t is a comþressed air
cy l inder . Two, i t is not a meta l pro ject i le as
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envLsioned in the original ord.inance, It is a plastic
ball with paint insid.e of í t .
O. With respect to an air soft gun you referred
to, is that capable of expell ing any sort of a
pro j ect i le?
A. I t expels a smal l sofÈ p last ic pro jecÈi le ,
typically through the use of a spring or a cornpressed
aír activity of a BB gun.
O. Is that a mechanical spring?
A . Y e s .
0. So we're not talking about combustion?
A. Cor rec t .
O. I 'm goíng to refer you back to Exhibit 3 for á
minute, which is the letter that, I bel ieve, you wrote
to the Nordykes. You \^rere asking for a written p1an,
correct?
A . R igh t .
O. Ðid you ever receive a response to thís letter?
A. A verbal phone calI, but nothíng in writ ing.
O. Ðo you recall ever receivíng a letLer from
Mr. Kilmer on behalf of the Nordykes?
A . Y e s .
O. I 'd l ike you to look at what ,s been marked as
Exhib i t 5 . I 'm handing a copy to Mr. K i lmer .
I f you could p lease read the le t ter , s i r , and
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then teII me what i t is.
A . I ' ve read the l e t t e r .
O. Ànd what is this letter?
A. This ís a le t ter f rom Donald Ki lmer , Jr . , the
attorney for T & S Trade Shows, addressed to myself
da ted Oc tobe r 20 , a999 .
O. I^tras it your understanding f rom this letter Lhat
the Nordykes were not going to attempt to conduct their
trade shows under the ordinance?
A. WeII, Èhe letter states that T & S Trade Shows
intends to proceed. wíth the November 6th and 7th show
until or unless the .Iudge declines to grant their
reguest for a Temporary Restrainíng Order as a result of
the hearing scheduled for October 28th.
O. Was it your understanding from this letter that
the Nordykes were not going to submit an explanation
that you had reguested as to how they could conduct
their t.rade shows ín compliance with the ordinance?
MR. KILMER: ObjecÈion to the extent that that
quest ion ca l1s for speculat ion.
THE WTTNESS: I could only refer to the closÍng
paragraph of Mr. Kílmer's let,ter that says, "I cannoÈ
find any language that requires them to submít a written
plan such as the one you requested. They do, in facÈ,
have contractual obl igations to comply with al l federal,
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state and locaI laws. please be assured that my cl ients
íntend. to comply with al l of their legaI obligations
both contractual and statutorv. 'r
MR. PIERCE: e. Thank you. Before I go on to
what's been marked as Exhíbit 7, I want to go back for a
minute and fo11o\4r-uþ.
The paint ball gun that you referred Eo during
t,he Out.door & Sportsmen,s Show,'had that been
pre-approved by the Fair Associatíon?
A. It had not been pre-approved by the Fair
Associat ion.
O. And how did you learn of i ts exístence on the
Fairgrounds during the Outdoor & Sportsmen,s Show?
A. In the process of the show loading in, which is
when the show is actually setting up and the booth was
set up, our staff normally walks through the
buildings whether they are custodial staff,
maintenance staff or event sÈaff and saw the paint.
ball display being assembled and contacted me.
I took a look at the display as it was
oD, asked were they actually sel l ing paint bal1
htere they actually sel l ing paint balls or not.
They ind.icaÈed all they were doing was
a discount coupon to go to the paint ball f ie1d.
contacted Lieutenant Knutsen who gave me his
90r-ng
guns and
sel l ing
I then
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interpretation.
0. And what about with respect to the air sofÈ
guns you mentioned? Had Èhose been pre-approved by the
Fair Association prior to the commencement of the
Outdoor 6. Sportsmen, s Show?
A. Let me back up. Answering
the show had not commenced. It was
your first question,
in the process of
discovered the paintsetting the show up where our staff
bal l gun.
O . okay .
A. We then received the verbal approvat from
LieuÈenant Knutsen before the show opened.
fn the case of the air soft pe1let guns or air
sof t r i f les, a s imi lar s i tuat ion. The show had actual ly
opened. Prior to the opening of the show, these pel1et
BB rif les h¡ere not, on displai¡. I t was in a chi ldren, s
area ínside of a building where there, s large canvas
walIs and that was al l that was ín that site.
When the show opened, these air soft r i f les
came out. Gentlemen with NR.A. baseball caps hrere
standing there. Lit, t le paper targets went up against a
large canvas waII and they were allowing children to
have f ive shots wí th a l i t t Ie p last íc peI Ie t .
How many air rifles are we talking about?
I believe they had f ive or six f ir ing stations
o .
A .
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in a líne and they
per f ir ing sÈation
O. I want to
marked as Exhibit
before, but we' re
Mr. K i lmer .
were supervised one NR-A, capped person
working with each youth.
show you what's been previously
6. I thÍnk I mistakenlv said Z
looking at 6. I 'm handing a copy to
Mr. Píckering, i f you could review this letter
and te l I us what i t is .
A. This is a letter from Terrj- Eagan Thut,
T-h-u-t, the Events Coordinator with the Fair
Association, addressed to T s. S Trade Shows,
specif ical ly SaII ie Nordyke. Enclosed with t.he letter
apparently was Check No. 3238, a refund of a deposít for
the year 2O0O event d.ates in the amount of $3,790.
O. Do you recognize the signature?
A . Y e s .
O. And you've seen Ms. Thut's signature on how
many occasions?
A. V'Ie have more than 300 evenLs a yearr so on many
occasions.
O. As far as you know, \^ras Lhis letter sent to
T & S T r a d e S h o w s ?
A. To the best of my knowledge, yes.
O. Did you receive a letter from Mr. Kilmer
earlíer this ]¡ear regarding t.he County, s ordinance? T
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mean, the ordinance that bans the possession of f irearms
on County property.
A . Y e s .
O. I 'd l ike to show you what has been premarked as
Exhib i t 7 . f 'm handing a copy to Mr. KÍ lmer .
If you could please review this letter and teII
us wha t i t i s , s i r .
A. Okay. L ,ve rev iewed. the le t ter .
0. And what is this letter?
A. This is a le t ter f rom Ðonald Ki lmer , ,Jr . ,
attorney for Russ and Sa11ie Nordyke dated February 25,
2005 add ressed to myse l f .
O. And did you ever respond to this lett.er?
A . Y e s , I d i d .
O. I 'd l ike to show you what ,s been premarked
Exhib i t 8 . I 'm handing a copy to Mr. K i lmer .
If you could look at thís letter and tel1 us
what i t is , p lease.
A. This is a letter from myself dated March 22ni,
2005, to Donald Ki lmer , J t . , ín response to h is February
25 th l e t t e r .
O. Now, you have responded here to Inguíry No. 1-
where it appears you,ve stated., rrAs a nonprofÍt
corporation, the Association is not aware that Ít has
any unique authority to grant exceptions to ord.inancês
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of the County of Alameda.'t
Am I correct to conclude that you were saying
that the Fair Association does not have the authority to
recognize any exceptions to the ordinance banning
firearms on County property other than Èhose exceptions
that are list.ed ín the ordinance?
A. V[e11, Ry response is rnuch broader than thaL.
As a nonprofít. corporation, the Fair Association is not
aware thaÈ it has any unigue authority to grant
exceptions Eo ord.inances of thq County of Alameda.
O. Okay. So your response is referríng not only
to the ordinance at issue Ín this case, prohibit ing the
possession of f irearms, buL you're referring to any
ordinance?
A. That is correct .
O. If I 'm correct in understandingr 1zour response
here would apply to the ordinance banning the possession
of f irearms. Let's just. focus on that one. Wou1d that
mean that you're saying here that the Faír Association
does not have any authority to grant exceptions to that
ordínance other Ehan what míqht be in the ordinance?
A. And we would refer to the County Sheriff 's
Ðepartment or County Counsel to determine an
interpretation of that exemptíon.
O. So the answer to my question is yes?
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MR. KILMER: Ob jec t ion .
is responsive to your ans\,ùer.
The wi-tness's resþorlse
THE WITNESS: I be l ieve Mr. K i lmer ,s le t ter o f
February 25, his f irst ínguiry is, trÏs the Fair
Association or I as the CEO able to grant exceptions
from any of the provisions of the ordinance forbiddíng
the possession of f j-rearms on County property?"
My response of March 22nd is that the Fair is
nonprofit corporation. The Faír Association ís not
aware that it has any unique authority to grant
exceptions to ordinances of the County of A1ameda.'t
I t 's implied that that íncludes the possession
of firearms and ammunition ordinance.
MR. PïERCE: Q. What f ,m get t ing at here is ,
the Fair Association would recognize the exceptíons that
are in the ordinance?
A. That ís correct .
O. Okay. That was the thrust. of my quesÈion"
A. If there was any question as to, 'rÐid that
exempÈion apply or not, I' we would inquire of the County
Sheriff 's Department as the chief law enforcement agency
of the County of Alameda for interpretatíon.
O. I 'd l ike to refer you to Exhib i t 4 , which is
the amended ordínance.
A. Very wel l .
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O. I 'd l Íke you t ,o look at Subdiv is ion F-4, which
is one of the except ions. I t ,s on page 2.
If you could just read that to yourself and let
me know when you,re f inished
A. Very well
O. Now, Ín your posit ion as the CEO of the Fair
Association, do you interpret this exception as l imited
only to motion pictures, television, video, dance and
theatrical productions or could the exception
conceivably include other types of events, and since it
mentions events here, perhaps an event that is akin to
the ScotÈish sames?
A. Again, f would defer Èo the Alameda County
Sheriff 's Department as our chief 1aw enforcement agency
to int.erpret anything outside of television, video,
dance or theatrical production.
I would indicate that the ScottÍsh Caledonians
believe their entire show or portions of t.heir show are
theatrícaI productions, thus the pageantry, the parades,
Lhe announcements, the reenactment of their battles
either with swords or fírearms would be considered by
them to be a theatrícal production.
O. If the Nordykes were t,o submit a plan to
explaining how they planned. to conduct their trade
shows, would you try and work with them to see if
you
there
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hTas a \á¡ay they could conduct as many aspects of their
trade shows as possible under the ordinance?
A. Yes, and we would also submit their plan to the
County Sheriff 's Ðepartment for interpretation regarding
the CounLy's ordinance.
0. If Lhe Nordykes submitted a plan that only
authorized part icipants in their trade shows could use
firearms and when those firearms were not in the actual
possession of those part icipants they were secured to
prevent unauthorized use, would that be a plan you,d
seriously consíder approvÍng or recommending approval
o f ?
A. We would forward ít to Countv Sheriff ,s
Department for review. In essence, the Fair Association
would not want to jeopardíze its operating agreement
with t,he County of Alameda that requires the Fair
Association to comply with al l ordinances and laws.
O. And one of those ordínances is the ordinance at
issue here banníng the possessíon of firearms on County
property, correct?
A . Tha t ' s co r rec t .
O. Since this ordinance has been adopted and.
I 'm referrÍng to in i ts amended form has anyone at
the County ever told you that the Nordykes could never
hold. their .trade shows at the Fairground.s?
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and the five or six aír soft guns you mentioned that
were present during the Outdoor & Sportsmen,s Shows,
have you seen any other guns or firearms whether or not
defined in the ordinance presenÈ during the Outdoor &
Spor tsmen's Shows?
Not that I recall .
MR. PïERCE: I have no further cnrestions at
7\
before?
A
o .
f i n e .
They have not.
Other than the one paint ball gun you mentioned
Y e s , s i r .
On how many occasions? A rough estímate is
A .
th is Èime.
EX.A}TTNATION
BY MR. KÏLMER:
O. Mr. Pickering, my name is Donald KíImer.
represent Russ and Sal l ie Nordyke.
Have you ever had your deposition taken
A. C lose to ten .
O. I see. Over the course of your career in
managing fairgrounds?
A. I spent L2 and a half years managing cities and.
the last. L2 years managing fairgrounds.
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0. Okay. I just want to start with some foIlow-up
guestions that Mr. Pierce asked you.
You mentioned durinq a conversatíon we had
prior Lo going on the record that there are Èhree active
campg'rounds on the faírgrounds? _,
A . Y e s , s í r .
O. These are people who come in wíth tents and
moLor homes and RV's and set, up camp and. jusE enjoy the
fairgrounds?
A. Predominantly RV's associated with the shows
taking place on the property.
O. So you make these spaces available
promoters and the vendors. Is i t also open
public?
to
to
the
the
A. It can be open to the public when it 's not
being used by a show produced at the fairgrounds.
O. Is Ít open to the public now?
A. Yes, i t would be. One of the three is open
now. One is under reconstruction.
O. One of the exceptions to the ordinance and
I'm going to refer you to Exhibit ¿ ís under,
"Except íons - Sect ior r F-5, r r which says a person lawfu l ly
transporting firearms or ammunition in a motor vehicle
or on a County road.
V,Iould that include, for instance, people who
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had had f irearms for personal protection in their RV's?
A. f would defer that to the County Sher i f f 's
Department to make that determination.
O. Have you made that inquiry to the County
Sher i f f 's Depar tment?
A. f have not .
O. You mentioned in your testimony when Mr. Pierce
was asking you guestions thaÈ the Scottísh Caledonian
Games had contacted you after the ordínance rlt¡as passed?
A. They did. speak with me, yes.
O. Do you remember who the person was thaÈ talked
to you?
A. I don't remember the person's name. There are
a number of Chieftains responsible for different parts
of the Scott ish Caledonian Games. It more than l ikely
would have been a Chieftaín responsible for the
pageantry display that included firearms.
o .7\
a .
person?
A .
o .
c a l l ?
A .
Did they send you a letter?
Not that I recal l .
So it was a telephone call or a meeting in
Telephone caI l .
Did you take any notes during that telephone
3 0
Not. that I recaIl, rfo.
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¿ >
O. What was the substance of the conversation vou
had with thís person?
A. To the best of my recollection, they asked me
if this ordínance applied to their historical
reenactment and I referred them to the County Sheri-ff 's
Department and County Counsel.
They noted that County Supervisor Scott
Haggerty had been an Honorary Chieftain of one of their
games and that they would speak with him directly as
well as talk wíth the County Sheriff ,s Department and
CounÈy Counsel.
O. Was that the end of your involvement with this
issue of how the ordinance affected the Caledonían
shows?
A . N o .
O. What other involvement did you have wíth
respecÈ to that?
A. I received a cal l from Richard Wínnie and Eríc
Chambliss representing County Counsel.
O. And what was the substance of that
conversation?
A. There was an inquíry as to what other
activitíes might take place at the fairgrounds where
firearms might be used.
ñ^.trd_
O. Vühat did you teII them?
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A. I reviewed hrith them the types of activit j-es
that take place at the fairgrounds. ï could not
d.etermine whether those activit ies would include
firearms or not.
I discussed the f i lming of TV commercials, the
fi lming of motions pictures, circuses, other shows that
take place on the fairgrounds.
O. And what was their response?
A. Their response was that :_n"y
had been
approached by the Scottish Caledonian Games lookíng to
see if there could be a potential historical reenactment
or pageantry exemption for what they do for their annual
August show.
, O. Did that conclude your díscussions about Lhe
Caledonian games and thís ordínance orwas there any
further discussions with anybody?
A .
o .
Only with my management sÈaff.
Did you receive any letters or writ ten
correspondence from the County about. the New Caledonian
Games and this ordinance, the issue with Lhís ordinance?
A. Not untíI I received the amended version of the
ordinance from the CounÈy.
O. Was there a cover le t ter speci f ica l ly
referencing the New Caledonian Games that was includei
with this copy of the ordinance?
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A. There was not .
0. Did the Scottísh Caledonian Games
a written plan as to how they would cgmply
ordinance?
ever provide
with the
A. Not to my knowledge.
O. Who was it that told you they were cleared to
have a show?
A. Wel1, there's much more to their show than
theír display.
O . OkaY.
TheÍr batt le scene reenacÈment.
But did you, for instance, consult with the
Sher i f f 's Ðepar tment?
A .
o .
A .
o .
¡ lbsolutely.
Who did you speak to at the Sheriff ,s
Department?
A. Lieutenant Knutsen. It may have been Sergeant
Knutsen at the time.
O. And he specif ical ly looked into the Scott ish
games, the Caledonian Show, and t,hen got back to you
with an answer, rrYes, they could have a show"?
A. That 's correct . There are many Sher i f f
Deputies that part icipate ín the Scott j-sh Caledonian
Games due to t.heir Scott ish heritage.
I bel ieve Sheriff Plummer also supports a
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Scott ish bagpipe band of Sheriff Deputies, so the
Sheriff DeputÍes have independent knowledge of the
activit ies of the scottÍsh caledonian Games at the
Fairgrounds.
O. Did you receive anything in writ.ing from the
Sheriffs or the Sheriff ,s Ðepartment saying that
caledonian shows wil l f i t into the exception of the
ordinance?
A. I d íd no t .
a. Now, with regard to the Sportsmen,s Show, you
gave some testimony Èhat you made some specific
inquir ies to the sherif f 's Department about air soft
guns and a paint ball gun. Any other specific
inqui r ies?
A. Not with regard to Èhe Sportsmen, s Show.
0. Any other shows?
A . Y e s .
o .
A .
0 .
n
Can you please teII me what those were?
Scott ish Caledonian Games.
Oh, just them.
They desired to bring in a Hauwitzer type
cannon from Camp Parks, a mil i tary inst,al lat ion in
Dublin. They wanted to include that in either Lheir
opening or closíng bag.pípe show
0. They wanted to f i re i t o f f?
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A. Tha t ' s co r rec t .
O. Did you refer them to the Sheriff 's Department
or did you make the inguíry?
A . Bo th .
O. Vühat was the result of Èhat inquiry?
A. The f irst year, the Pleasanton Police
Department. asked that they not do it because that was
fol lowíng the year fol lowing g/l l in New York City.
The Pleasanton Police Department felt that that
loud of a percussion might generate phone cal1s to 91-l
as to what was goíng on in the cornmunity, so they did.
not f ire a cannon that vear.
The next year, they did bríng in a smal1 cannon
from Camp Parks conducted under Lhe fuII authority of
the mi l i tary .
O. I just want to get our dates correct. The New
Caledonian Show usually occurs in August, I think?
A . Cor rec t .
O. And the events you described, September L1-th,
was weLl, actually i t was September 1Lth, so that was
2001. So it would have been the 2002 New Caledonian
Show?
A . C o r r e c t , 2 0 0 2 .
O. Just so \^re ' re c Iear , ín 2002, Pleasanton Pol ice
Department asked that there not be --
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A. A percussíon generated from a cannon.
O. But , in 2003 there was?
A. ïn 2003 the re was .
O. How about the show in
A. In 2005 there was, and f bel ieve there may have
b e e n i n 2 0 0 4 . I d o n , t r e c a I l .
O. Are there antique shows that take place Ïrere at
the Fairgrounds?
A. There are.
O. Do you know whether or not antigue firearms are
ever displayed?
A. I have not seen an anticrue firearm at the
Pleasanton Fairgrounds .
o .
wag
A .
So you have no personal knowledge if there
That's correct, nor has any of my staff
reported that, to me.
O. Do you know whether or not antíque fírearms
excepted under the ordinance?
A. f do not know. T would refer that question to
the County Sheriff 's Department.
O. hlas an inguiry ever made to the County
Sheriff 's Ðepartment about f irearms being an exception?
A. Not to my knowledge.
O. Did you ever inguire to the County and/or the
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Sheriff 's Department i f gun shows would be considered
exception to the ordinance under this Section No. 4?
A . Y e s .
O. V[ho did you talk to?
A. Richard Vtinnie and Eric Chambliss.
O. What was the subsLance of that conversation?
First of al l , Iet me retract thaL. lrÏhen did that
conversation take place?
A. At the Èime thaÈ I receíved the amended
ordinance, I contacted County Counsel and asked for
their interpretation as to, ,tl¡lou1d Èhe gun show fit
under these exceptions or not?'r
0. Vühat did they tel1 you?
A. Their response was that Èhey would need to see
a written plan, run it by the Sheriff ,s Department and
get an interpretation based on the components of that
pIan.
A. Mr. Pierce had asked you a question that, "No
one at the County told you that T 6c S could not hold a
show, I' and your response was, Do, nobody told you they
cou ldn ' t ?
A .
o .
show?
Tha t ' s co r rec t .
Did anyone teII you that they could hold
A . Yes
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o .n
O .
And who was that?
Richard frTinnie.
On how many occasions did he do that?
A. Severa l .
O. Can you please recount those for me and give me
approximate dates?
A. There 1¡¡ere roughly two verbal phone
conversations in which Mr. v' I innie stated, yês, a gun
show could be conducted provided that there was a plan
in place that outrined how the show would. be conducted-
wíthout possessíng f irearms and ammunit ion as defined by
the ordinance and that Mr. Winnie in the second phone
conversat,ion beIíeved that that might become the state
of the art for future gun shows at the faÍrgrounds,
whatever this plan may look like
O. That sounds l ike a pretty involved
conversation.
How would i t be possible for the new state of
the art gun shows to be conducted without guns present?
MR. PIERCE: ObjecEion, ca l1s for speculat ion,
but you could answer
THE WITNESS: I,11 answer as Èo what we talked
about in the phone conversation.
MR. KILMER: Absolutely
THE WITNESS: Specif ic suggestions related to
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the internet, the display of firearms or ammunition via
the internet, the display of f irearms or ammunit ions off
site of the fairgrounds through technology on the
fairgrounds, a replica of f irearms that might be
considered exempt under the ordinance so that somebody
could hold them in their hands, but Èhey would not be a
true firearm whether they were wood, rubber or
metal and maïI order business
Again, most of the d.iscussion revolved around
changing technologies. For example, Fairgrounds used to
have computer shows and we don'È any more because
computer shows are passe. People buy the compuÈers
through stores and over the internet.
MR. KILMER: Q. And there was also the
August 23rd le t ter f rom Mr. Winnie. I '11 refer you to
.E;Xlll_þl_tr l_.
A. That 's correct , re ferencing the or ig ina l
ordinance before amended.
MR. KILMER: Mr. P icker ing, I 'm going to show
you a copy and ï had prepared exhibits for you to
look at as well and Mr. Pierce has already pretty much
covered all of the correspondence but there was one
letter he left out, though, that I 'm goíng Èo ask you to
idenEí fy . Let 's have th is marked as Exhib i t 9 .
(Exhibit 9 marked for identif ication. )
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MR. KILMER: -Q. This exhibit is redundant of
a lot of exhibits that have already been admitted, but
there is only one addit ional letter in there that I
wanted to refer to and that 's a December l -Oth, Lggg
le t te r .
Could you please look at that letter and Iet
know when you're done looking at it?
A. Okay.
A. And this is a December
T & S Trade Shows and ít,s also
Thut, Events Coordinator?
LOth le t ter addressed
signed by Terri Eagan
to
A . Tha t ' s co r rec t .
O. And it 's basical ly informíng the Nordykes of
the balance due on their account and letting them know
that a l l o f the i r 2000 dates have been re leased; ís that
correct?
A . Tha t ' s co r rec t .
MR. KILMER: Thank you. I,m going to show you
a document I '11 have marked as Exhibit J-0.
(Exhibit l-0 marked for identif ication; )
MR. KILMER: Q. Take a look at this document
and let me know when you,re done looking at. í t .
A. Okay.
O. And this is an invoice generated. by the Alamed.a
County Fair Association and it ,s dírected to T & S Trade
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Shows. This looks l ike an invoice for mavbe theír
October show. Excuse me. I t looks I íke i t ,s the
November show or September show.
That would be aecurate, the September show.
The net invoice to the Nordykes is ç9,79O.50.
To the best of your recollection without having to
revíew your records, is that about the amount of revenue
that the T & S Show gienerated for the County every time
it had a show?
A. Oh, i t would have
O. How much more, i f
been more than that.
you could recaIl?
generate parking revenue andA. WeI I , shows a lso
food reverfue.
O. And al l of that goes Èo the County?
A. None of i t goes to the County.
O. Excuse me, t .he Fai r Associat íon.
A. A port. ion of roughly 25 percent, of gross food
and beverage sales goes to the Fair Association.
this point in time, wê had an independent contractor
operating the parking lots, so a percentage of the
parking revenue would have come to the Faír Association.
0. Do yor,r have in your mínd an estimate of the
amount of revenue that was generated per show by the
Nordykes including what they paid for rental and the
revenue generated for food and parking?
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A. In l-999, Ry staff explained to me that Lhe four
gun shows produced by the Nordykes generated between
$80 ,000 to $100 ,000 i n revenue to the Fa i - r Assoc ia t Íon .
That was not net. That was gross.
O. I understand. A:rd you understand. that the
Fairgrounds is not a party to this lawsuit?
A . To the bes t o f my know ledge , ' t ha t , s co r rec t .
O. Is there a 1aw firm that handles the
Fai rground's Iega1 af fa i rs?
A. There,s a variety of legaI counsel that is used
based upon t,he issues.
O . okaY .
A. For example, personnel claims, w€ would
contract with an expert ín personnel law.
O. A l l r í gh t .
A. Contract , land use, l icense and lease
agreements.
O. okay.
A. county counsel does not serve as counsel for
the Faír Assocíat ion.
O. Fair enough. That's where I was going anlrvray.
Thank you.
ï 'm not ask ing for that adv ice. I ,m just
asking if you sought any advice about this ritígation
and its impact on the Fairgrounds from any of these law
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f Í rms?
A. From our insurance carrier, Yês.
A. All r ight. Thank you. Your insurance carríer
or a law f irm?
A. Oh, ï 'm sorry. fnsurance carríer and. attorneys
representíng our insurance carríer.
O. Vühat guestions did you have for your insurance
carrier?
A. The insurance carrier at the time when the
ordinance was adopted was representing the Faír
Association against a number of claims and a very large
lawsuit from individuals that were ímpacted by the 1-998
shooting ín the carníval midway.
O. That leads me to my next l ine. of quesÈionj-ng.
Before that, though, I do want to ask you a questíon.
f 'm not interested in whaÈ your salary is, but
I 'm interested if there is a component of your salary
that is generated by the profits generated by the
Association or i f you're on a straight salary?
A .
o .
A .
There is no eguity part icipation at al l .
So just straight salary?
Tha t ' s co r rec t .
MR. KILMER: Let 's go of f the record for
minute.
(Discuss ion of f the record. )
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MR. KILMER: Q. You had' mentioned earl ier that
there was a shooting in the midway' That occurred
during the Annual County Fairt is that correct?
A. l-ggï Annual CountY Fair.
O. And you were not workíng here at that time?
A. I was not .
O. So contrary to what sometimes ends up in the
newspaper, which you are not responsible for, this
shooting did not occur at a gun show?
A. ThaE 's co r rec t .
o . A n d . t h e r e w a s a l a w s u i È f í l e d a f t e r t h e ] - 9 9 8
shooting?
A. There were many lawsuits fí Ied after Èhe 1998
shooting as well as insurance claims.
o . A r e y o u a w a r e o f a n y o t h e r s h o o t i n g s t . h a t h a v e
occurred at the Fairgrounds other than that incident?
A. Not to my knowledge.
0 . W a s t h e F a i r g r o u n d s n a m e d i n t h e l a w s u i t t h a t
arose out of the L998 shootíng?
A. All of the lawsuits and claims, the Fair
.A.ssociation was named in to the best of my knowledge.
O. Do you remember the name of the firm that
defended the Fairgrounds?
A. Not off the toP of mY head.
O. If you know, and I concede this may be a 1ega12 5
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question, what r,tlas the theory for the Fairground's
t iab i l i ty in that case?
MR. PIERCE: Object ion, i t caI ls for a legal
conclus ion.
THE WITNESS: I don't know what the legal
theory was. The claíms that were submitted were due to
tLre fact the incídent occurred on the Fairgrounds
property and the Fair Associatíon was the custodian of
the property under a managiement contract with the County
of Alameda.
MR. KILMER: Q. Vühat was Èhe disposít ion of
the case? Did i t go to t.r ial or hras i t sett led?
A. Both. There were many cases. Some were
sett led by the ínsurance company. I bel ieve l-8 ended up
joÍning together for one they joined their l i t igatíon
together into one tawsuit. I t did go to trÍal. I t did
go through the appellate court as weII.
O. What was the result?
A. The Fair AssociaÈion was found to have ímmuníty
for discretíonary 1aw enforcement decísions during the
run of the Annual Alameda County Fair.
O. So there was no l iabíI i ty to the Fair
Associat ion?
A
O .
That 's correct
Do you know whether or not the person who díd
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the shooting was charged with the crime?
A. Yes, i t was a separate cour t case.
0. Do you know the disposit ion of that case?
A. That went to tr ial. He was sentenced to prison
t ime .
O. Do you know how long gun shows have taken place
at the Fairgrounds? Obviously, f 'm asking a guest. ion
that precedes your history, but i f you know.
A. I do not know how long gun shows have taken
place at the Alameda CounEy Fairgrounds.
O. Were they taking place before you got here,
though?
A. Yes, they were.
year .
Roughly Èhree to four per
O. All r ight. You seem to have come in to your
position here at the Fairgrounds just about the time
this ordinance was passed and no more gun shows have
Èaken pIace, but to t.he extent that you know, were the
Nordykes good tenants?
MR. PÏERCE:
to the te rm t 'good. t t
MR. KILMER:
contracts, pay theÍr
place in good order
Objection, vague and ambiguous as
O. Ðid they comply with theír
bi l1s on t ime? Did they leave the
when thev were done?
A. I did have the opportunity to wítness two, i f
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not three, of tlre Nordyke, s gun shows on the property
during 1999. To t,he best of my knowledge, they complied.
with the terms of their contract,.
O. Vüho has law enforcement jurisdict ion over the
Fairground.s?
A. The County of Alameda Sheriff has ult imate
jurisdict ion for law enforcement within the county of
Alameda, to the best of my knowledge. llowever, the
Fairgrounds is incorporated into the city of pleasanton,
so the property is owned by the County of Alameda, but
incorporated into pleasanton.
O. Just so h¡e're clear, the Fairgrounds is County
property?
A. The FaÍrgrounds is owned by the County of
Alameda, incorporated into the city of pleasanton.
a. Does the law enforcement jurisd.ict ion ever
shift between events?
For example, is the City of pleasanton
responsibre for Iaw enforcement most of the year, but
the sherif f 's responsible for, for instance, the Annual
CounEy Fair?
Is there a sharing agreement like that or is
this something that the two law enforcement agencies
work out among themselves?
A . Y e s .
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O. I deserve that answer. I f you could explain
how that works, i f you know.
A. Absolute ly , yes. The Fai r Assocíat ion,s
management agreement with the county of Alameda reguires
the Fai r Associat íon to use the County Sher i f f ,s
Department during the annual fair for on ground. security
and law enforcement purposes.
Outside of the annual fair, the County
Sheriff 's Department is actively involved wíth
activit ies that take place on the rairground.s since the
property is owned by the County of Alamed.a.
Day-to-day 1aw enforcement issues and a number
of the year-round shows or activit ies that take place at
the Fairgrounds are coord.inated with the pleasanton
Police Department. There are cert.ain shows in which
both the Police Department and County Sheriff 's
Department are involved. in working through 1aw
enforcement plans and st.rategÍes ín add.ition to our
cívi l ian contracEed security f irm. That company is
named Security Eye.
O. And. they are a loca1 company?
A. They are headquartered in Livermore.
O. Do you have an opinion about what event or
events that take place at the Fairgrounds pose the
biggest securíty problem? If you d.o have an opinion,
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I 'd l ike to know what that is .
MR. PIERCE: Object ion, assumes facts not in
ev idence.
THE WITNESS: The fíreworks show on thè 4th of
Ju ly .
MR. KILMER: e. What. are the concerns there?
A. The SherÍff ,s Department wil l not support a
f ireworks show on the 4th of ,ruly at the Fairgrounds.
Therefore, our Ínsurance company would have
major guestíons íf we attempted. to conduct a f irework
display on the 4th of ,Ju1v.
0. Is that because of safety issues or law
enforcement issues?
A. Bo th -
O. Any other events that requÍre extraordinary
security?
A . Y e s .
O. What would be t.hose events?
A. Presidentiar campaign stops, vice presidentíaI
campaígn stops, Governatorial campaigns and political
races typical ly require the use of metal detectors.
O. okay.
A. Not as a reguirement of Ehe Fair Association,
but as a requirement of their actual event. Ànd a
currently sit t ing president visít ing the Fairgrounds.
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O. Any cultural or holiday events that are a
part icular security concern?
A . Y e s .
A. What, would those be?
A. When the annual Afghan New year,s event moved
onto the Fairgrounds, they had had a troubled reputation
at o ther fac i l i t Íes.
Roughly 7,000 to B,OOO Afghanis at tend. that
event. They have now been here for four or more years
and have had very successful events. The fírst event
was a challenge.
O. Any other events j-n that same category?
A. Any new show brings about a certain IeveI of
concern depending on the t)rpe of a new show is, i f i t 's
an event that has not been conducted here before.
o. Are you aware of any particular law enforcement
concern that was raised regardíng the gun shows when
they h¡ere here?
A. None to my knowledge.
O. I,m goíng to try and thread this guestion as
carefu l ly as I can.
You received a lett,er from Mr. I¡üinnie on August
23rd, L999 as referenced by Exhibit r-. rs that the
first time you heard about an ord.inance that would. be
banning gun shows at the Fairground.s?
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MR. PIERCE: Object ion, misstates the character
of the ordinance
THE VüITNESS: It is not the f irst t ime that I
heard that the County was considering the adoption of an
ordinance to address the possession of f i-rearms and
ammunition on County-owned property.
MR. KILMER: Q. When was the f irst t ime that
you became avrare Lhat the CounLy wanted to implement
that policy?
A. In advance of the 1999 fair.
O. How did you learn about i t?
A .
a .
A
ï was contacted by Supervisor Mary King.
And what was the conversati-on you had wíth her?
She indicated that she had planned to introduce
and announce an ordinance and that she wanted to do that
the opening day of the 1999 fair.
O. Did she te1l you why she wanted to do it then?
A. She indicated that because the shooting took
place in 1998, she felt an appropriate place to announce
the ordinance was the openíng day of the t999 fair at
the Faírgrounds.
A. And did she, in fact, make that announcement at
the ] .ggg fa i r?
A . She d id no t .
O. Do you know why she didn't?
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A. r requested her not to do that in that we were
attempting to recover from the shooting incidenÈ from
the l-998 fair and encouraged her to consider making her
announcement, perhaps, the cl0sing day of the fair so i t
would not adversely generate med.ia attention to the
shooting from the prior year and give us the opportunity
to recover as best we could ín L999 from the impacts of
the l -998 shooÈinq.
A. Díd she change her mind and. gÍve an
announcement at the end of the fair?
A. Two days after the f irst phone caIl, she calred
me back and indicated she would consider d.oing it the
closing day of the fair.
O. Did she, in fact, make the announcement on the
closing day of the fair?
A. r belíeve the announcement came one or two days
after the faír closed and the announcement came out of
Downtown Oakland.
O. Other t,han Ms. King trying t.o schedule this
announcement, díd she discuss with you any other aspects
of this policy she wanted to enacÈ into an ordinance?
A. Not that f recaI1. The gist of the phone
conversation was to seek my assi-stance in coordinating
the announcement of the ord.írrance opening d.ay of fair.
O. Other than Ms. King, did anyone else contact
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you from the county about this new policy t.he county
wanted to enact?
A. I don, t , recaI I .
O. Did anybody at all contact you about this
policy of banning guns on County property?
MR. PIERCE: Object íon, vague as to t ime.
MR. KTLMER: Before t,he ordinance hras enacted.
THE WITNESS: f don, t recaI l specí f ic
conversations with county offÍciars regarding the
ordinance before it was enacted, but there were many
conversations between me and the county sherif f ,s
Department related to the t-999 shooting, specif ical ly
related to media inguiríes that would come at the Lggg
fair as to what we were doíng to prevent a símilar
occurrence in i_999
MR. KTLMER: e. What d id you do in L999 to
prevent a símilar occurrence?
A. We purchased walk-through metal detectors.
O . A I1 r i gh t .
A. hÏe put together a media protocol. vrre hired. a
professíonal crisis communication consultant to coach us
behind the scenes. we expanded our on-ground public
address system. rve insti tuted crear beverage cups for
alcohol and soda and other d.r inks. we insti tuted a
program where the beverage cup for alcohol had a yell0w
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logo on it and nonalcoholic drinks had a blue 1ogo.
That allowed law enforcement a beÈ.ter opportunity to
identify someone consuming alcohol, partÍcularly i f they
appeared to be a mÍnor.
We put together extensive evacuation
pIans. I,,Ie had a number of law enforcemenL and safetv
servj-ce coordination meetings with County Fire,
Livermore/Pleasanton Fire Distr ict, pleasanton polÍce
Department, Highway patrol, Caltrans, the Sheriff ,s
Department, Èhe state of carifornia Department of Food &
Agr icu l ture, Div is ion of Fai rs & Exposi t ions.
v'Ie also put together a tabletop exercise. All
of the individual agencies r mentioned as welr as
members of our Fair Board and arl of our management team
participated in a tabletop disaster exercise. Those are
some of the technigues thaÈ we were developing to emproy
at the tggg ta i r .
o. would i t be fair to characterize those ster¡s
you took as a success?
A. we did not have a shooting at, the tggg fair.
T ¡üe a rso c losed , r be l i eve , a t 5 :oo o r 6 :00 on the 4 th o f
,Iuly and díd not conduct a fireworks show.
o. And the county Fairs since rggg up through the
most recent one have also been a success or at least --
let me rephrase that
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You haven,t had any firearm problems at any
County Fai rs s ince 1999?
MR. PIERCE: Object ion to f í rearms problem.
ï t ' s vag 'ue.
MR. KILMER: you can answer i f you think you
can. Ot,herwise, I, 11 try and rephrase .
THE IVITNESS: f would not classify them as a
firearm problem.
MR. KILMER: e. you haven,t had a shootíng at
the Fairgrounds during a County Fair sínce tggg?
A. Not at the Alameda County Faír, but at oÈher
fa i rs in Cal i forn ia.
O. The metal detectors, are they sti l l at the
entrance to the Fairground.s?
A. They are. rn fact, ürê rent our metal detectors
to six other fairs in the Bay Area.
o. And they are used every t ime there is a public
event, not just for the county Faír; is that correct?
A. They are predominantly used at the fair, but
Lhey are used at, some other events on the Faírgrounds
depending on the type of event.
0. For instance, wir l patrons have to pass through
the metar detector to go to the Hura show this weekend?
A. They will not. They did. have to pass ttrrough
metal detectors to go to the Hot rmport Days car show
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three weeks ago.
O. Who makes the decísion about whether an event
requires the use of metal detectors or not?
A. The decision is joint ly made between the Fair
Associatr ion, law enforcement and the event Þromoter.
However, in some cases, the event promoter chooses to
use meta l detectors.
For example, in the case of po l i t ica l ra l I ies,
it is normally whoever is renting the property,
whichever poli t ical party, chooses to rent, the metal
de tec to rs .
O. Do you have a set of cri teria that you have
that you wil l reguire Èhe use of metal detectors for an
event?
A. Depending on a hi_story of a part icular show at
o the r f ac i l i t i es .
For example, when the Afghan New year,s Show
first ,came here and there had been weapons issues wíth
them at other faci l i t ies, we dÍd requíre the use of
meta l detectors.
O. In the discussions you had prior to the
enactment of the ordinance wíth representatives of the
county, were you asked about any 1aw enforcement issues
relating to gun shows?
A. I bel ieve I was gueríed by the County Sheriff ,s
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staff on my knowledge of gun shows at the orange county
Fairgrounds.
O. I¡üere you asked about the Nordyke shows at all?
A. 'I
was asked if the Nordykes produced the show
at the Orange County Fairground.s and they d.o not..
O. Are you aware of any security issues
specif ical ly related to the shows that the Nordykes put
on?
A . N o .
O. Are you aware of any safety issues specifÍca11y
related to the shows that the Nordykes used to put on?
A . N o .
o. Do you know whether or not the Nordvkes híred
their own private security for their shows?
A. They have indicated to me that they did provide
secur i ty .
O. Díd you have a way of verifying that?
A. v'Ie produce a pre-event t.abretop for most of our
shows, whích involves 1aw enforcement, safety service,
medics, security Eye paÈrol, event promoter, âny major
sub-events that are taking place within an event, so
through the process of pre-show evaruatíons and planning
as well as post-show wrap-ups, those discussions wou.rd.
have taken place with our staff.
A. Do you know whether or not the Nordykes
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híred off duty sheríffs to provide security for their
shows?
A. I do not know.
A. You said you vùere the Assistant Ðirector of the
Oranqe
A. The Deputy General Manager of the Orange County
Fairgrounds.
O. And how long did you hold that posit ion?
A. F ive years.
O. Did you do similar work before that?
A. I was involved ín city manag'ement for 1,2 years
pr Íor to that .
O. And was your work
paraIleI or similar to the
Fairground?
A . y e s .
in city management at al l
work you're doing for the
a. And what would that involve?
A. Pub1ic safety , po l ice, f i re , const ruct ion of
infrastrucÈure, roadways, police stations, f ire
stations
o .
sense?
For instance, lvere you managing events in that
A. We cert,ainly had events in our parks. We had.
celebrations ín our parks. i¡r le also íssued permits,
parade permits, event permj-ts, for very large festivals.
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a. How would you characteríze the events that take
prace at the orange county Fairgrounds as opposed to the
Alameda county Fairgrounds? Are t,hey similar or are
there d i f ferences?
A . Y e s .
0. That 's another fa i r shot . What would be the
di f ferences?
A. The orange county Faírgrounds has in excess of
four mílI ion patrons a year come to the property.
Alameda county Fairground.s has in excess of three
mil l ion patrons a year coming to the property.
The 20-plus day annual Orange County Fair wílI
have close to one million people come through during
their annual fair event. The Alameda county Fair will
have in excess of 4oo, ooo patrons come through a l7-day
fai-r each summer.
The largest amount of year-round. attend.ance at
the orange county Faírgrounds was generated. from t,he
orange county Marketplace, which can have 2s to 2g,000
people every saturday and every sunday on an asphalt
parking Iot. The majority of patrons coming through the
Arameda county Fairground.s on a year-round basis are
comj-ng to 300 plus different shows.
o. All rÍght. Did the orange county Fairgrounds
al-so have gun shows, dog shows, antique shows,
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sportsmen' s shows simílar to the Alameda Countv
Fairgrounds?
A. I don ' t recal I a spor tsmen,s show, but yes, the
other shows are similar. The other major difference is
that the Orange County Fairground.s ís a state agency
fair known as a Distr ict AgriculÈural Assocj-ation,
whereas we are a nonprofi_t corporation.
O. Other than the August 23rd, J,999, letter from
Mr. lüinnie and the two copies of the ordinance, have you
received any oÈher wriÈten material from t,he County
having to do with this ordinance?
A. Not that f reca1l .
O. Did the County ever ask you td post notice of
the ordinance on the Fairgrounds?
A. Not that I reca1l , r ro .
a. I noticed when f walked in today there Ís a
blue sign on Èhe post at your gat.e here and-it talks
about restr icÈions on Èhe Fairground.s.
For instance, there, s motor scooÈers and
skat,eboards and there's actually also a prohibit ion of
f irearms. Do you know when that sign was posted?
A. T do not. I could f ind out, but I don,È know
O. Was it here when you started. working here?
A. It may have been. f don, t know.
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O. There are other notíces posted at the
Fairgrounds, though, for instance, reg'ulating alcohol,
smoking, dogs and parkirg; is that correct?
A. That,s correct. Care and cust.ody of the
property has been delegated to the Fair Association.
O. Has Èhere been any boat shows here at the
Fairgrounds?
A . Y e s .
O. And car shows?
A . Y e s .
O. Home shows?
A. Home and Garden Showsr 1r€s.
O. Dog shows?
A. Big DeI Val1e Dog Show.
O. And I am part ial to cat,s, but cat shows, too, f
imagÍne?
A. There have been cat shows.
0. Computer shows are one thíng that have gone
away?
A. There are computer elements of a number of
shows now, particularly wíth web technology, but the
original compuÈer show that traveled the fair circuit
does not exist any more.
O. Do you do any marketingi research about the
types of people that wil l attend different types of
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shows here at the Fairgrounds?
A . Y e s .
O. What kind of research is that?
A. Vüe have explored the possibi l i ty of bui lding a
new l -00,000 square foot exhib i t ion haI l , so we h i red
several dif ferent companies Lo do market analysis,
market saturat,ion in the Bay Area, ilCould such a
faciliËy generate enough revenue for debt service and
operational costs? r '
O. Any other kind of marketing research?
A . Y e s .
O. What kind would that, be?
A. v,ïe do demographic studies rerated to our annual
fair patrons. we do exit surveys. we do phone call
surveys. We,ve done focus groups.
O. Has any of this research ever related to qun
shows?
A. Not speci f ica l ly . In the case of the larse
building, they took a look at what types of shows j,"r"
beÍng produced in the Bay Area market or what tlpes of
shows would like to make enLre into the Bay Area market,
something smaller than Mosconí center, but bigger than
t-he buildings we have available now.
O. Who was making that Ínguiry?
A. Rod Markin & and Associates.
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O. Who are thev?
A. They are a professional consult ing f irm that
develop economic impact studíes for fairs and other
sports faci l í t ies and entertainment venues throughout
the Uni ted States.
O. Would i t be fair to say you have a 1ot of
experience, professional experience, with regard to what
kind of events might be successful and whj-ch ones might
be not as stríke that.
Would you say that you have guite a bit of
professional experíence with regard to what type of
events would be well-attended and what type of events
might not be wetl-attend.ed at the Fairqround.s?
A. There are some events that we encouragie not to
take place because we do not believe they wil l generate
att,endance.
For example, there hras a new women's event that
they t i t , led. themselves in such a way that we felt the
public wourd have no clue what that event would be.
They had one show and went bankrupt.
O. f see. Any other t14>e of
A. There are shows that we would not aIIow to come
to the property. For example, a11-night shows.
O. A l l r i gh t .
A . Raves .
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O. A l l r i qh t .
A. We don,t. alIow raves. We do not al low
al l -n ight dance par t ies, par t ícu lar ly for teenagers.
O. All r ight. I guess piercing and tattoo shows
might be out, too?
A
O .
A .
shows.
shows.
o .
Not necessar i ly .
A l l r ight .
f 've done Harley shows. I ' ve done Easy Rid.er
Body art and piercing has been part. of those
fÈ 's occasional ly parÈ of the car shows as wel I .
All right. Fair enough. Ðo you have an
opinion as to whether or not people would attend a boat
show at the Fairgrounds if there were no boats present?
MR. PIERCE: Object ion, caI Is for speculat ion.
MR. KILMER: I ,m ask ing i f he has an opin ion.
THE WTTNESS: f don ' t know. I web surf to look
at boats on nboat t rader .com.Í
MR. KILMER: e. yeah, but I think my question
was a bit more specif ic. Ðo you think the publÍc would
attend a boat show knowing that there would noÈ be boats
present?I
A. I don, t know
O. All r ight. Do you think people would attend a
car show knowing there would. be no cars present?
MR. PIERCE: Same object íon.
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THE WITNESS: Agiain, it depends on how__€he show
is produced. There are no homes at the home show.
MR. KILMER: e. Fair enough. Ðo you think
people would atLend a dog show if there were no dogs?
A. It depends on what they were looking for.
O. So if people were actually going there
expecting to see boats and there were no boats, they
would be disappointed?
A. I would be disappointed if I went anywhere
expecting to see somet,hing and ít wasn, t there.
O. All r ight. Fair enough. So is there any
reason to think people would atÈend a gun show if there
were no g'uns present?
MR. PIERCE: Same object ion, speculaÈion.
THE V\IITNESS: In my experience, there are
components of different shows that drive attendance.
MR. KILMER: e. And guns would be a crit ical
component of a gun show to drive attendance?
A. There are hunters that attend the sportsmen, s
show that does not have guns because they are looking
for other t14>e of gun-related. paraphernalia.
O. But thaÈ would be people att,ending a huntíng
show?
A. Spor tsmen's Expor fês.
O. Right. Arrd people attend.ing an advert ised gun
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show wourd probably expect to see guns present, wouldn,t
they?
MR. PIERCE: Same object ion.
MR. KILMER: e. you could answer i f you think
you can.
A. If they had been to a gun show that had guns
present and it was the same promoter, Lhey would more
than l ikely be anticipating the same type of merchandise
that they had experienced. in the past.
O. Do you have an opinion about whether or not
this ordinance was d.rafted with the specif ic intent of
banning gun shows?
A. f do no t .
O. Are you aware that, there was a 1awsuit
involving the banni-ng of gun shows at the santa crara
County Fairgrounds?
A . Y e s .
O. How do you know about that 1awsuit?
A. f bel ieve I was sti l l at the Orange County
Fairgrounds when that was taking pIace. r believe
something similar took place at the LA County
Fairgrounds at some point in t.ime
o. You stated in your earl ier testimonv that in
1999 you instal led metal detectors at the ent.rance to
the Fairgrounds and that they are being used. for every
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County Fair and some other events as we1l.
Do you know whether or not any weapons have
been confiscated. at the
A. Yes, they have.
O. And were there arrests made?
A. We have had arrests at eventsr 1r€s.
O. No. I mean, were there arrests made for trying
to bring the weapons onto the County property?
A. The typical weapon which we would confiscate
would be knives that exceed the County,s three-inch
blade under the county ordinance or under the county
Sher i f f 's Depar tment gu idance.
There are indivíduals that have attempted to
walk through the metal detectors with a f irearm in Èheir
possess ion .
I belíeve each and every one of Èhose
incidents weII, al l except one of those incídents
ínvolved off-duty law enforcement personnel with a
permit to carry a concealed weapon and we do have a
protocol in place should they choose to continue onto
the property with a concealed weapon.
A . A l l r i gh t .
A. 'They have t,o check in
Lhe Sheriff Deputy keeps a 1og
encourages them not Ëo consume
with the Sheriff Deputy,
and advíses them --
a lcohol .
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VIe did have a cowboy type entertainer who had
replica of a pistol in his duffel bag as part of his
regalia. As he attempted to walk through the metal
detector, the metal detector went off. As they opened.
h is bag, they saw h is p is to l . They d idn ' t know í f i t
\^tas a replica or not, so it became an immediate law
enforcement issue.
O. Is that the other incident,, the one incident
you saíd did not result in an arrest?
A. None of the ones f mentioned resulted in an
a r res t .
O. A1I r ight. Are there any incidents that have
resulÈed in an arrest?
Let me narrow the focus of the cruestion. Do
you know whether or not there have been any arrests
pursuant to the ordinance for bringing a firearm onto
the Fairgrounds?
' A- There have been no arrests, to the best of my
knowledge.
O. Does the Fairgrounds have any faci l i ty for
storing f irearms on the premises?
A. If you could define that for me.
O. Are there, for instance, âfly vüeapons lockers aE
the entrances?
A. Nó- There are hording cells that the sherif f
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uses duri-ng the annual fair, but to my knowledge they
are not used to contain weaponry.
A. Now, you mentioned earlíer in your testimony
that you're the sole employee of the Fair Association?
A. Correct . Excuse me, Èhe Fai r Board.
O. So there are other employees of the Fair
Associat ion?
A. Of the corporat ion, that ,s correct .
O. And those would be the staff here and the
grounds keepers and the custodial workers?
A. lVe have roughly I_40 fuII-t ime equivalent
pos i t i ons .
O. And. they are al l employees of the Assocíation?
A. Under the terms of our bylaws and art icles of
incorporation, they are.
O. Do you know whether or not any steps were taken
to inform those employees that they could no longer
bring firearms or ammunition onto the Fairground.s after
this ordinance was passed?
A. I 'm not ahrare that anv
firearms or ammunition onto the
of this ordínance.
employees were bringing
Fairgrounds in advance
O. ?[as there ever a memo generated after the
ord.inance was passed. tel l ing employees, ,ryou couId. no
longer bring f irearms onto the property'r ?
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A. Not to my knowledge. We conduct quarterly
safety meetings with alr of our employees in compliance
with osHA regulations. tve also do our employee of the
guarter awards and we do tailgate safety meetings at the
same tíme and all of the employees would have been
briefed on this new ordinance.
O. So would that be documented in an agenda for
one of these meetings, for instance?
A- Probabry not. The agenda doesn't go into that
level o f deta i l .
O. Who conducts these safety meet ings?
A. A var ie ty of Índ iv iduals par t ic ipate, mysel f ,
any number of our six department heads; vicki Hunter,
who is our Human Resources offieer, depending on what
we ' re d i scuss inq .
0. I want to refer you to Exhíbí t 3 . That ,s the
sept,ember 7tr}: letter from you to Russ and sallie asking
for a wr i t ten pIan.
Were there any other let,ters Iíke this
generated to any other promoters during thís time
period?
MR. PIERCE: Object ion, vagiue as to " l Íke
this - 'r
MR. KILMER: e. Was there ever any other
letters reguestíng a wrítten ptan from any promoters
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how they would comply with Alameda Ordinance 0-2OOO-t_L?
A. Not to my knowledge.
O. So your Èestimony ís that only the gun show
receíved a letter of this type?
A. Speci f ic to th is ord inance.
O. okaY.
A. A,nd thaL was due to the Nordyke,s telephone
conversation with me indicating that they did not
believe they could comply with the ordinance.
O. Do you have a standard contract with a1I of
your promoters and exhibitors now?
A. We have I Ícense ag:reements, correct .
O. Ðo those l icense agreements contain a provision
reçrir ing compliance with this ordinance?
A. Yes. It requires complíance wíth al l
ordinances, laws, rules and regulat j-ons.
O. Does t,he l icense ag'reement specifÍcalIy
reference this ordinance?
A . N o .
O. Are the promoters and exhibítors given notice
of this ordínance?
A. If they reveal to us thaÈ they are planníng on
having a f irearm as part of their show, y€s, they would
be advised of i t .
O. But there is no policy or practice for doing
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that wi-th al l exhibitors or al l shows?
A. They are not given a copy of al l f ire
ordinances for f ire codes or f ire lanes. they are noÈ
given a copy of al l ordinances as to how their
electr ical eguipment should be set. They are inspected
to Èhe County standards.
O. But most people know that they have to comply
with Federal and state 1aws. very few people know that
there may be a county ordinance forbidding possessíon of
a gun, so i t 's somewhat of an unusual ordinance, isn, t
i r ?
A. There are many county ordínances that we
enforce that may be different than state or Federal Iaw,
partícurarly when it comes to health and safety and food
se rv i ces .
MR. KTLMER:
the rest room.
ï need to take a break to qo to
(Br ie f recess taken. )
MR. KILMER: e. I bel ieve that Mr. pierce may
have asked you this guestion, but I just want to get
c lar i f icat ion,
Referring to Exhibit No. 4, the current
ordÍnance, do you have an opinion as to whether or not
the gun shows as the Nordykes had historically conducted.
them would f i t into any of the exceptions l isted in
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Section F of the ordinance?
MR. PÏERCE: Object ion, ca l Is for a lega1
conclus ion.
THE WITNESS: I do not know. Any plan that
they would submÍt to me, I would submit it to the County
Sheriff 's DepartmenË and County Counsel for revíew of
compliance with t.he County ord.inance.
MR. KILMER: Q. So you would see yourself
prímari ly as a conduit, not rea1ly making the decísion
a t a l l ?
A. WeIl, if somebody came onto the property and we
saíd, trThe Fire Code reguires a 2}-foot separation
between your Èwo portable trai lers, r ' and they said., rVüe
don't bel ieve that i t does. V,Ie have a d.i f f erent
interpretation,rt we would turn that over to the county
Fire Department.
The same thíng on materials of tent fabric.
Vühen different promoters bring in different tent
fabrics, ür€ refer Èhem to the county Fire Department to
make sure they have fíre clearance on the fabrics.
O. For instance, i f the Nordykes had submitted a
plan regardless of what t.hat plan would be wou1d.
you review the plan and t.hen pass it on to the Sheriff ,s
Department with a recommendation one way or the other or
would you simply pass it on?
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A. I would s imply pass i t on because there 's been
ongoing litigation between the Nordykes and. the county.
O. And you would abide by whatever d.ecision the
Sheriff 's or the County made with regard to the gun
show?
A. Under the terms of our contract, \^¡e are
required t.o comply with all ordinances and. it would be
awkward for us to re-interpret an ordinance that the
County adopted.
O. fn other words, if the County turned to you and
said, trThe Nordykes look like they are putting on a
theatrical production. co ahead and ret them have their
shows, I ' you would say, "Okay, f iner '?
A. I would say, ' rpuL i t in wr i t ínç[ . "
O. But you would make sure the County put, it in
writ ing for you?
A. Absolute1v.
o. You menttorr"u ín your earli-er test,imony that if
you thought any particular show might include a firearm
component that you would raise thaL issue in pranning
the event.
Other t,han the Gun Show, the New Cated.onían
show, the sportsmen's show, and we'l l go ahead and ad.d
Antique show to that, are there any other events that
fa1l into that category that you would presume there
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might be firearms and you want to brj_ng that to their
attentíon?
MR. PIERCE: Object ion to the quest ion in so
far as the Antíque Show. That misstates the testimony.
MR. KILMER: I '11 withdraw the Anticrue Show
ñ ã r r
THE I/üITNESS: For example, we hire a fair t ime
entertainer. ÌVe have, what we calI, the four horsemen
who d.ress up like a cowboy on a horse, but the horse is
actually part of their costume. If I were to notice
that they had a pistol in a holster, we would have them
immedÍately and r have had Èhem immediately go the
sheriff 's Ðepartment and have the sherif f verify that
i t 's a rep l ica and i t has no f i r ing capaci ty .
MR. KILMER: e. Fair enough. Any other event,
you could think of?
A. hlel l , certaínIy polít ical ra1líes when they
híre privat,e security that wÍIl have f irearms. lrle
request that they go to t,he pleasanton police Department
and/or County of Alameda Sheriff ,s Department for
verif ication thaÈ they have proper permits for those
weapons.
For example, a gover¡ror poli t ical ra11y, from
time to t ime, in addít ion to State po1íce and Highway
Patrol, Èhey may hire private-armed securíty
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O. A l l r i gh t .
A. An exampre wourd. be a concert during fair time
whereby Mya was here and she had armed security. That
armed security had. to check in with the county sherif f ,s.'
Ðepartment and show a permi_t for their f irearms.
O. okaY.
A. This last year was Raven Simone from rrThat,s So
Raven. r' she had tü¡o armed security with firearms in
their fanny packs and they were required to check in
with the sheríff 's DeparÈment for verif icat, ion that they
were properly l icensed and permitted to have those
weapons.
o. You mentioned t,hat the Fairgrounds has its own
private securiÈy company or f irm.
A. We do not have a company. We contract.
O. okaY.
A. we just, issued. a Reguest, for proposals this
week. Every so many years we competitively bid
d i f ferent contracts .
O. What training is provided to those security
guards with respect to this ordinance?
A. A successful bidder wil1 have to províd.e
of cal i fornia Guard cards and cert i f ication that
have been off icial ly trained and hold. current
cer t i f icat ion in the State of Cal i forn ia.
State
they
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a .
which is
exception
I 'm going to refer you again to Exhibí t 4 ,
the ordinance. For example, there is an
to the ordinance
Y e s .A .
o .
carry a
] -2050.
under F-3 for a person holding a permit to
f irearm issued pursuant to penal Code Section
A. Security Eye in advance of each annual fair
brings al l of their personnel together who wil l be
working at the annual fair and the sheriff,s Department.
brings ín a special instructor to go through with each
of the Security Eye personnel how to man and how to
staff the metal detectors and. what to do if they come
across a fírearm, what would be considered a val id
permi t or not .
Any fírearm that comes through a metal d.etector
has to be immediately that indívíd.ual ís immedíateIy
detaíned unti l such t ime as a sherif f Deputy can come
and make personal contact, so security Eye would not be
asking them, t r l ,e t ,s see a copy of your permi t . i l
O. So Èhe protocol is for them to get a peace
officer involved. and then they make the determination?
A. We have Sheriff , s deputies at al l of our
admiss ion gates.
MR. KILMER: Fair enough. Let,s take a qþÍck
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break.
I just want to revíew my complaint, and your
answers real quick and t,hen r think r might be d.one.
(Br ie f recess taken. )
MR. KILMER: e. Mr. pickering, you mentioned
off the record that sometímes graduation ceremonies for
Sher i f f 's deput ies occur here at the Fai rgrounds; is
that correct?
A . Tha t , s co r rec t .
O. On average, how many tímes do those ceremonies
occur per year?
A. Perhaps once Ín the last f ive or six years.
MR. KILMER: Al_I ríght. I have no further
guest ions.
MR. PTERCE:
f o l I o w - u p s .
I just have a couple of
FURTHER EXAIvITNATTON
BY MR. PTERCE:
O. With respect to the Scott ish giames, are you
aware that anyone other than an aut,horized. particÍpant
in the scott ish games has used a gun during the scott ish
games?
A. I 'm not aware of anyone eIse.
t2. Are you avrare whether or not there,s ever been
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any gun Ieft. unsecured when not in the immed.iat.e
possession of an authorized part icipant in the scott ish
games?
A. There has been no al legations of that nature
that have come Èo my attention.
O. My f ina l quest ion is , you s tated. , I be l ieve,
that Exhibit 3 was the only letter you had .ever
sent to
the operator of an event on the Fairgrounds reguesting a
pIan, but I just want to make sure I ,m c1ear .
You did ask the Scottísh Games to submit a plan
prior to the amendment of the ord.inance? you just
didn't send them a letter asking for the plan?
A. I bel ieve the ordinance had. been adopted, but
was not yet effective, in effect, during that part icular
scot,t ish Games, but we brought to their attention that
that ordinance would be in effecË for their next year, s
game and that, they would need to explaín to us how they
could comply to that ordinance.
O. Okay. you didn't send Èhem a l_etter sayíng
that? That was a verbal conversation?
A. It was whíIe they were here during theír
show.
a. But you d idn ' t send them a le t ter?
A. I d id not send them a 1et ter .
MR. PIERCE: I have no further cnrestions.
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FURTHER EXAJVITNATTON
BY MR. KTLMER:
o. Has the scott ish games ever submítted. a writcen
plan about how their show will comply with the
ordinance?
A. They went to the County and had. the ordinance
amended and the Countlr Counsel and County Sheriff has
assured me that t,hey do, in fact,, comply with the
ordinance as amended-
MR. KILMER: Nothing further.
(Discussíon of f the record. )
MR. PIERCE: I propose t.hat we fol1ow the
procedures in Rure 30 of the Fed.eral Rures of civi l
Procedure, which wil l be that the reporter wil l prepare
a Èranscript of your testímony and wirr provide iÈ to
Mr. Pickering. Mr. pickering wíI1 have 30 days to
review the transcript and. make any changes to the
original and wil l noti fy the court reporter i f any
changes have been made and they wirl be incorporated
into the Lranscript, by the courL report,er.
I, as the noticing attorney, wil l keep the
original of the deposit, ion transcrípt in the condit ion
that i t wil l be usable and ï wil l make it available to
Mr. Kilmer upon reasonable request.
ff for any reason the origÍnal becomes
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destroyed, a cert i f ied copy may be used in i ts place.
MR. KILMER: So st ipu lated.
(Discuss ion of f the record. )
THE REPORTER: V,IouId you like a condensed
transcript, an index or an Ascii?
MR. PIERCE: I think an index would be he1pfu1,
y e s .
THE REPORTER: titrould you like a copy?
MR. KILMER: T,11 order a copy and I would l ike
an r_ncex.
(Whereupon the deposition conclud.ed at
approx imate ly L2zt t p .m. )
( l lo st ipulation being entered to the contrary,
the witness shaIl have 30 d.ays after the
completion of the transcript ion of the
foregoing deposit ion within which to revíew,
correct and sign the original of said
transcript; and thereafter, the original
Eranscript will be forwarded by the court
repor ter to MR. PIERCE,S of f ice, to be by them
mainÈained j-n a sealed cond.ition pursuant to
Code unti l further order of the Court.)
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I hereby declare under penalty of perjury that
r have read the foregoing deposÍtion transcrj-pt and. have
noted thereon any comments, changes, corrections or
addÍtíons r feel are necessary to accurately reflect my
ansl^Iers to the guestions propounded therein to the best
of my knowledge and belief.
Signed at on
RICK K. PICKERTNG
Page 82
l_ STATE OF CALIFORNIA ) .
ô¿ ) s s -
3 COUNTY OF )
+
5 On this
6 rfl€,
day of , - , before
, a Notary
7 public in and for the state of carifornia, d.uLy
I commissioned and sworn, personally appeared
g RIGK K. PIcKERTNG
l_0
l- l-
1-2 known to me to be the person whose name is subscribed.
13 to the within deposit ion, and. acknowledged. that they
1-4 have read, corrected.'rnd. "*"cuted.
the sameI F
t l
1"6 rN vÍrrÌ{Ess IÀII{EREOF, r have hereunt,o set my hand, and.
L7 affixed my seal t,he d.ay and. year first above written.
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NOTARY PTJB]-,TC
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STATE OF CALTFoRNIA ) ss.
COUNTY OF STANTSLAUS )
I - , Ho11y D. Hensyel , a l icensed, Cer t i f ied
shortand Reporter, duly quali f ied. and cert i f ied as such
by the State of Cali fornia, do hereby cert i fy:
That prior to being examined, the witness
named in the foregoing deposition was by me duly
affírmed to testi fy to the truth, the whole truth, and
nothÍng but the truth;
That the said depositiorl r¡as by me recorded
stenographically at the t ime and prace f irst herein
mentioned; and. the foregoing pages constitute a fuI l ,
Lrue, complete and correct record of the testimony given
by the sa id wí tness;
That I am a disinterested. person, not being in
any way interested Ín the outcome of said action, nor
connected wíth, nor related to any of the part ies in
said action, or to theír respective counsel, in any
manner what,soever.
ïN VüITNESS VüHEREOF, I have hereunto set my
hand rhis AàJ- day or ^.l
ny,^Mll , 2oos .
Page 83
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REPORTER' S CERTIFTCATTON
RE CERTTFTED COPY OF TRÃNSCRIPT
I , HOLLY D. HENSYEL, a Certi f ied Shorthand Reporter
in the State of Cal i forn ia, L icense No. 1O5OB hereby
cert i fy that the foregoing transcript is a true and
corcect copy of the original deposit ion transcript
containing t.he testimony of RICK K. PICKERING, given
under oath on NOVEMBER 3 , 2OOS.
Dared rhis Ð nfLday or ÑWr^tll¡, 2 0 0 5 .
N O . l _ 0 5 0 8
Page 84
CE, {TRA!- CALIFORNIA RTPORTERSCertified Shorthand and Video Reporters
Main Bookkeeping and Calendaring251 West Jackson Street . post Office Box 362
Sonora, California 95.370. (209) ss2-93s2 FAX (209) s32-s362
(800) 347-218sNOVFìÍBER 22, 2005
MR. RICK K. PICKERING.4501 PLEASANTO¡.{ AVENUEPLEASANTON, CA 94566
DeaT MR. PICKERING:
You now 'have an opporbuitypursuæt 1o tüs civil Çode ofProcsftrc tp lwburthe hæsorþtof your d€positioü itr tåeabiwemctt€rwi&io -3o-dcys¡iøtomaftemyadditions*o*nroti*lyoodä;ä-õ, mdtosigqthedç,"sirioûbsfûr€aNotûypuuilffimc" i"f.{p*trtb. cioil cø""fno"oirr. toprovide that shouldypufonauyrenson notrwieryand sþyourdepositionqd¡rlfolh, above liæ, itwillbeik@çd nie"rdtyyd ol.t*ã; m¿çân'beusd*tnorgsügnÊd and appreved byyouAcc@ingþ' ty- . óncuu¡na zi ' zoo5
-rj-oTotrïrüiufonrs¡düeotiginaltræsÉrÞtfu aseeled mnditioo to &u upptop ftrtber o¡ater of úe courtIfyou *ish 1o rcvierv md corrcot and sþ your depositiø, i *ry * d* ir ;""irry "rîóijfu"¿*e
rhose checkmarkedbelosn- ¡¡¡You
ua5r oall us 7 days in advmce Ûo set w ro *ppoinheuf to rsview yorrr tauscrÍpt bçfûrç a Notary public in
, xx Yoü mry revi€'w ¡ copy útained tbrough ycrur alton¡sy and be caa aôuise rtis otgce hy letter of ooy correctirxs or. additiorcyonmaywishtomelce. 1
_You nry review úe encloseit cffriûÈ{:gey, CONSTILï yOuR. Á.TïORNEY ¡F yOt¡RU A pARTy, mnkyourconunflús ontheenelosedtist, sigtr the usr üd¡eturnrhetistintheeaclosed_¡"uaoi"ia ad&essedøvelope.' , You m¿v rwieçv the enctosea õriginål t**tpt, coNsìtli-foun nrtoRhiEy fu ?ouru ¿ pARTy, &aw ¡linrc tümughthe wordsycnrwishto ch{ng;, tebg ore¡dnot to m¡keúe *igi*l*r"d_,*rudrtle, ddffiúltyuriteyourcomm€rüs sbovs üe s'iol€Nr w-ord+ fign page*. ufy nenarf of p*.i"qr-;ãrsrur; aË;öd to the address i'disated orüe etolosed slaryd addrÞsæd enrreþe. V* *oul¿ *t n t" #üruo*-to ûfhing büt yoru mswers. or yoo .cau makeyolrrcotm€ûts onthe e'nclosedlist tignthe list aadftetanseipt atrsch the lisrn*"lt"iJru @osition andmailitintre
. enclosed eavelo¡le, w -.! sv+' v¡ u
RE; NORDYKE VS. KING
tiayarbitutiorldare, pleesç respmd by mailingyow curectiol listuy , or forinsusrcepyby- - ,- . ,:. _ _-*uo**o*.yyouroorîesl
Úaitimory Ûo ¡11 souûsel in üræ. If ]ry aee{ to nake ö*"g@ pi"rrË *t ø }Ðür {üûrr€y.
Dü€ to the upcomingby--
Sincereþ,Ceutrel CrXtrorulr Reryorten
By: SUE KOPTIEFFcc. AII CouoselJob# 5gggetrv.
po w9 am conv€yyour oomest
505-1 "S" StreetHighway 49, Suite 232
Jackson, C/.95642
Main Street #1 39Manteca, CA 95336
' 40108 Hiehwav 49
Suitet-' lg'Oakhurst, CA93644:.
5 05 West Whittier.AvenueTrary, CA 95376
2847 North "C" StreetMerced, CA.95340
.TO:. CENTRAL CALIFORNIAREPORTERSP.O. Box367Sonora, Catifornia 95370
RE: NORDYKE VS. KING
Dear Sin
f have received , ¡cviewþ the ORIGINAL-COPY- of the tanscript ofmy dçostion-
( ) I have ¡ead it and.sigrred it under penalty ofpet'ury and am retunring it herewith with no correctíons fo bc noted.
( ) I havç read it and signeil it under penalty of perjtrry and am rehrning the kanscript herewith wifh my correctionsindicated thereou.
( ) I have read it a¡d im sr¡brnittinq ue cogec$-9ns listed below, and I fiuther certify unde,r penalty ofpqrjury that, Subject to same cgrrections, said transcript is
'true ancl corrcci, to the best of -y tnoú"Ag".
SIGNED UNDER PENALTY OF PERIURY
DATED: RICK K. PICKERING
CORRECTIONS:
PAGE LINE SIIOULDREADASFOLLOWS:
#s088
DEPOSITION OF: nrcr x. prcrsnrNc
DATED: NOVEMBER 3, 2OO5
CASE NAME: NORDYKE VS. KING
Job Number 5OBB
CORRECTION LTST PAGE 2
PAGE Lr-I\iE sHouLD READ,A,S FOLLOWS:
. SIGNATURE OF DEPOSITION WIThTESS
( ,
v r l o t / t y . J 5 t 7 : l l
Ençlosure
925-426-7699
C ( ) U F . I : f y
A-A'IEDA COI¡.ITV FAIR
C O T . J N I S E L
August 23, tggg
llt .Oak Street, Suft€ 46g. Oaktârrd, Cefllornta e4ø12-aZS6Telephone (6t0) 272-0700 -.-'-fu*
(StO) 272.s020
PAGE ø4
4IçHAFD E, WNNI€CouNff couNsEL
Richard K. plckerlng, Generaf ManagerAlarneda County Fa-ir4501 Ple asanton AvenuePleasanton, Cailfomla g4 566
Re: Gun shows; oijlqrye Prohlbltlng thE possesston of Ftrearme on county property;Ordinance No. 0-2000_1 I
Dear Mr, Pickering
As yo.u know the Alameda 9,,.]1v Boerd of supervlsors adopted the above referencsd ordinance
l,'."iffi! ;"itåil|îåfr¡:fåús;ä;' '"ábing ãn Á¿õ,üii. r gee, A copy or rhe ordinance
The ordinance will take effect.on.septembe-r rg 1999. puor"ni tô seclion l5 of the conlraçtProvidins for oper:ation "r h" fi;;i; öJrlnty Èar, tsepieäleîäs, rsez¡ th. Faírsrou¡¡ds musrbe operared in compfiance wirr ãnâ-frråï" ra*r;lñË:;öiltiionç and ordinancès, incrudingthe attachod ordinance.
we recognize that sorne media rcports have Indicalêd lhat this ordlnance prevenls gun $hows, Thisis nol üre oase' Gun sr¡gws '.i Ë ;rrd;i"d ;; rÈ. Ë¡iöìrîdï, provrdad rhar rhey compry wrth{he ordinance's reslrlctioo." oniÀã ãii'i,üi,L.."1rreuims"aài'ä-mmun¡r¡on on Gounty properry.Fireann accessories and. othei päãpdffi; rnat are noiLittrin ilä o*nniuons of secrío ng.1z.12oor the ordinance mav: bq o¡sálâiãããä'Ï¿io ,¡ anv'åìî'-¡îåw. r¡e ordínanco àfço does norproscribe the sale of'flrearms oi tt*urtion-provrJnä tir"i;;Ë';,ii.res ceôriotb€ dísplays6 on rhefiremisles.
|fyouhaveanyquestionspteasefee|froclocon[acrmyoff lca.
(? EXHIBIT
t qe - o Õ
Ë ?i¿tcerinq :-
0 ï
Very buty,youno,
RICI-IARD E. WINNIËCounty Coúnsel
07-t8-05 llz24 Ftc' 'ards,lYatãon û Gar¡hon +714 gg. T-532 P.002/005 F-zEs
ORDINANËE HE. O.2OOO-II .
AN ORDINANCE ADD|N,G SECT¡ON 9.12.120 TO THË COUNTY ORÞINANCE CODE
þnoniÉff¡Nc THE PossEssloN oF FIREARMS oN couNTY FRoFËRTY
THE BOARÞ OF SUFËRVISORS OF THE COUNTY OF A.LAMEDAoRDAINS A$ FOLLOWST
SËOTION I
That the Ordinance Code of the County of Alameda shall be amendëd to add Section 9'12-120 to
read as follows:
9.12.120 Possessiort of Firearms on county Froperty Prohibited
(a). Findings. The Board of Supervisors finds that gunshot fatatities and injuries are
of epidãmic proportions in Alameda County. DurÍng the first five years of thelggb's gZg ñonì¡ciAes we¡^e cornfiitted using firearms, and an additional1,647victims were hospitalized with gurtshot injuries. Firearms are the leading guseof death among young people between the ages of 15 and 24 in Alameda.County-BetwðènJury t-,iSUoänd iune 30, 199¿ 136 juveniles were anested in Oatdandfor gun-retatäd otrenses. CIn July 4, 1998 a shooting incident ol lh9 AlamedaCoünty Fairgrourrds rÊsultÈd in severälgunshot wounds, other injuries and panic
among fair gìers. Prohibiting the posseçsion of fireanns on county proPÊdy'' with tiie exåpfion of law enforcemènt personnel in the performance of officiel
duties, wiU prbmote the publie health and safety by contributing to the reduction ofgunshot fatalitÎes and injuries in the county
(b). Misdemeanor. Every pêrson who carries onto Çounty of Atameda (hereinafter.Çounty*) property a fire¿rm. loaded or unloaded, or arnmunition for a firearm, isguifty of a misdemeanor.
(c). County FrOperty. County property includes real properly owned or leased by
the County, and ¡rr County's Possession, or in the possession of a public or
frivate eniiþ under contraetwith the County to perform a public Purposè. By wäy
;l*;.*pi;,'it inctudeç att pubtic buildings and tfr.e surounding grounds owned or¡àased dy tre County în th'e unincorporated and incorporated portions of theCounty, åuch as the Alameda County Fairgrounds jn the City of Fleasanton.
(d). Fire'arm. 'Firearm" is any gun, pistol. revolvêr, rifle or any device. designed or
modified to be used as a weapon, from which is expelled through a banel aprojectile by the force of an explosion or other for¡'n of combustion- lt alsoinciu¡es any insi¡ument which expels a metalllc projectile, such as a BB or apellet, throuih the force of air pressure, CO2 presËure, or spring actiort-
(ei. Ammunit¡on, "Arnmunitlon" meãns a cartridge or cartridges composed of
cartridge cases, primers, bulfets, or pro-pellant pgw-der designed lot u¡e in anyfirearm-. lt does àot include cartridges from which the propellant has beenremoved and the primer Permanenüy deactivated.
ÐfiIB¡T
Lz ?i cKer\n
F a c s i m i l - e R e c e i v e d o n 7 / L 8 / 2 0 0 5 1 1 : 3 1 : 1 6 A M
U ¿ÕÕ6
07-f8-05 llt24 tror,' ¡rards,l{atson t Gsr¡hon
AYES: SuperwisorsNOEE; SuperviçorEXCUSED: nqne
+7t4 Sgt
Carson, Kfcg, Steele  Preçtdenc Chan - 4
ÉaggertY - 1
T-532 P.003/005 F-269
( f ) .PeaceQf f i cer .A"Feaceof f i ce f ¡s .anypersonwho isapeaceof f ÏoËrasdefined in Tlle 3, part 2, chäË; +-giiiri" california Penal code (sectiorts 830
ef seq') '
(g) .Ëxcept ions'Secl ion9'12'120(b)doesnot,ap"plytoaFeaceoff icer;aguardormessengÊr of a financiat ¡nEi¡tuì¡ón, a gua¡d of a contract carrier opefat¡ng an
a rmo reåv;;ñ¡.l -
"äËtiä¿
iüìtát- inËsti gator' Fatrol op e râto r' o r ãlarm
compaiy ö;;ff oi unifoiåeU sãcurity gî_a¡o as these occ'pations are defined
in penat-Code section 1203ïidiand wh'oirotds a valid certificate issued by the
o*partmunt or consume., eÈàiåînoàr Penal code section 12033, while actually
*'lìp,ovää'åiî ãngág*d i" üot-rtr"g and preservins propertv or life within the
scape of friu oi nit Jmptoyment; a-p-erson holdino a valid license to carry a
¡r""rm-ir.Lä' óäirùãrinó iãitJr êãã ã s ect¡on t ãoso; a person lawri.rll v
transporting firearms o,. "-*inition
in a motor vehicle ort Courtty roads; a pÉrson
lawfrrlly using the target onöË.oi*cl-bYlheAlameda Côunty Sheriff; a federal
"¡m¡nårîñu;"i,î,å; Ë; n* Ënrsicêment officeç or s member of the military
ror.*räi'ü.,;êìäîå;f c;tiù;;äor;f the united states while ensased in the
Performance of his or her dutY;
sEcTloN l¡
Thisordinanceshalttakeeffectandbeinforcethirty(3.?)!?I:fromandafterthedateofpassãge and before ffi;;;-;*iËn oinneei Jãvi anei ¡tÉ paisage it shar be_published once with
the names of the .n**ð"-oîot¡t,g for and agái¡istthe same in the tnter-City Express' a
Ëir¡siäã punrished in the Çountv of Alameda'
Adopted by the Boa¡d of suçervisors.of the county of Alameda' state of califomia' on the lTth
oáv'àr{"e- 1999, by the following called vote:
President of the Eoard of SupervisorsCounty of Atameda' State of Califomia
ATTEST: CRY$TAL K HISHÍÞA, CIETKof thã Board of $upervisors' êounty of Alameda
' i 3
rlFA|Rl0
F a c . s i m i l e R e c e i v e d o n ' 1
/ I B / 2 0 0 5 1 1 : 3 1 : 1 6 A M
ôa7
ø9 / t . 7 l Lgeg 1? t11 ;-.426-7693
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4501 P¡råsaÀton Avenue
September 7,1999
AI-AÈ1EDA ÈÀ ' FAI.R PAGS Ð2
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rAx (925) 426.7599. :
Via: FaxRcBísfprþd ry-ail
T&STradeShcw
å{4i Ru¡r ft,S¡lIiç gordykcP.O. Box 871 :Willqrvr, CÂ 9S98s
Ë EXH|B|T
g a b? '\-/ Ie c c \ä ?ìirefìnq *
RE¡
Qear Mr. & MIs. Nordyk-e:
As yop arç a.ware, rhp ,{l$ûeda^Courty Farr Aisosi¿tioo (esrociariOn) iË.¡ uon.profitcorpoaatioq which thou$.n_Og$rlrg,Ágrçcme¡¡t with tt¡e ;CoooiíofÃffiiü.''rtls$sges .Fu lBo4O¡¡ o.f thp Faffioundr.-Sdion tl oftlrio,onc*i¡s:rqreentd;i{Çguirrs tho ô4çociaüon to operæc [d coilpliurce with ¡ü f.øe,-if :St*ã; ñi¿ øúutyr g g u l a t i o u s ^ : . . :
, .
S?ú* b qynr of Atrmq{a Couutyi.p Orrti¡a¡çç lr[e. O¿qOOi r r,,{rioU prolúbirc rh€Possossroü arqre{ffis åqd en¡¡n¡nitio[on c,ounry-property: ¡lgo:rlu¿alÊd íi e lçrier totbe A¡soçìuio¡ &o.ru tiob¡rd B. Wisú!, CouÉy C.r;rrl.. .' : ,
i Ì .i.'lu i l
øslø7/L999 17:11 5-4?6-7699
RKP:clh
sc: Fair BoardAlarneda Cou¡ty Boa¡d of SupervisorsSu$ap MuranishlRiehard B.IVinnie
T & S ftuù Show Ltr .Pe.i
ordin¿nce No 0'2000-t r. The Ássociatron wilr hord the darø ofNovetpber ls aud -Ê,1999, open fo1¡gu h F: þp-qr rfrt p"i ,i"w ¡nay *otinue a¡ct ùe in comptiance withthe County of ,{lamed¡.'¡ Oidinance:
TûanÌ ro.u fo1¡pur titugty ¡.1teutíon ø thi{ matt€r. The A¡sociation rook¡ forwsrd ro d-conti¡r¡ed positive relatlonsbip y/ith T & S ira¡;¡n*r.*-""-
ALAI1EDA CL V FAIR p¡eE a3
U È J
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l l : 2 5 Frofi- ' 'ds,flat¡on t ûarshon +711 SS0 T-532 F.004/005 F-26S
oRDINANCE NÖ. 0-2000-22
AN ORDINANCE AMEND¡NG SECTION 9,12.120 OF THE COUNTY ÖRDIÍ'IANCE CODEPROHIBITING THE PO$SËSSION OF FIREARMS ON COUNTY FROPERTY
THE BOARD OF SUPERVISOR$ OF THE COUNTY OF ALAMEDAORDAINS AS FOLLOWS:
SECTION I
That the Ordinance Çode of the County of Alameda shalf be amended by revising Section9.12.120 to read aË follows:
g.12,120 Fossession of Flrearms on county Froperty Prohibited
07-l s-85
(a)
Ë EXH|B|TE ¡ l t nE r t ?Ê ^--- cñã ftcKerintl -l-
(b)
(c)
Firrdings, The Board of Supervisors finds that gunshot fatafities and injuries are ofepidemìc proportions in Alameda County. During thq IFt fiv.e,y-e3¡ of lhe 1990's 879hbmicides were cûmmitted using firearms, and an additional 1,647 victims werehospitalized with gunshot injuries. Firearms are the leading cause of death amongyouirg people betfueen the àges of 15 and 24 in Atameda County. Between July 1, 1996ånO Jilne io, 1ggz, 156 juveñiles were arrested in Oakland for gun-related ofienses. onJuly 4, 1998 a shooting incident on the Alameda Çq"nty Fairg¡ounds resulted in severalgunshot wounds, othei injuries and panic among fgf S.oery... Prohibiting the possessionõf f¡r".rms on County property wilt promote the public heatth and safety by contributing tothe reduction of gunshot fatalities and injuries in the County-
Migdemeangr. Every pêrson who brings onto or pos$esses on Çounty propefty afireann, loaded or unloaded, or ammunition for a firearm is guil$ of a misdemeãnor'
County Property. As used irr this SeÇtion, the term Cour¡ty properly meäns- realproperiy, incìudiñg any buildings ffiereon, ovrned or leased by the County of Alameda
ineieinåito .Couãty"), and in ti're County's possessio¡, or in the possession of a p_ublic
òr private entity unáel contract with the County to perforrn a pubtic purpose' including butnoi l¡m¡te¿ to re¿l property owned or leased by the Çourrty in the unincoçorated andincorpootud portiðns'of tíre County, srrcfi as ùie County park in Sunol and the AlamedaC;"rity Fairgiounds in the City of Fleasanton, but does nqtinclude any "local publibbuildirrg'aslenned in Penal Code Section 171b(c), wheJ¡ the State regulatespossess¡o,r of fi¡:earms pursuant to Fenal Code Section 171b.
(d) Firearm, 'Firêârm" is any gun, pistol, revolver, rifle or arry device, designed or modifiedto be used a5-a weapon, nóm wt¡Lgb-E-E¡pelled through a banel a projecTile by the forceor ãn-erÞlG¡oÞr oúrer io rm o@mUusn'òþ "Fireann" does not include imitatiortfiresrfisþEg-guns ána air riflËn ãEïeffi-d In Governrnent Gode Section 53071.5'
(ê) **un,Oorri**un¡t¡lli, uny ammunitiçn as defined in PerralCode Section'
12316(bX2).
(f) Ëxceptions. subsection 9.12.1?0(b) does not qPplIJo the following:' (l ) A p"J"* officer as oefin'eú in Ttle 3, Part 2, Ghapter 4.5 of the California
0i i
F a c s i m i l - e R e c e i v e d o n 7 / 1 , 8 1 2 0 0 5 1 1 : 3 1 : 1 6 A M
Õ^LÕ
û7;18-05 l l r25 From-' ' 'ds,Watson t tarshor +7t4 gg0
, and Steele - 4
Vice.President of the
T-532 P.005/005 F-269
Penal Ëode (seotions'830 etseg')'(2) A guard or messênger åf a financidl institution, a guard of a contract carrier
operating an ãrmoied vehiÇle, å l¡censed private investigator, pâllol operãtor, or afarm
çompany op"iát*, oÍ unifonned security gtlard as.theçe occupations arp defined inpenåt CäOË se"t¡oh 12091(d) and who froids a valid cedificate issued þy the Departmentof Çonsume. Ãffairs underþenal Code section 12033, while actually employed andengaged in protecting and preserving property or life within the scope of his or her
. emploYment;' '(g) A person holdirrg a valid.licençe to carry a firearm issued pursuant to Penal
Çode section 12050;- - - (4) The possåssion of a fiçãrm by. an-authorized participant in a motion picture,
tetevisiòn, v¡oãð,-oãnce, or theatrical proäuction or event. when the participant lawfuflyùses the nre"*'aï partof that produöt¡on or event, provided that when such firearm isnot in the actr¡al possession of the authorized participanl it is secured to preventunauthorized use.
(g) A pJoOn lawtutly trarrsporting firearms or amrnunition in a motor vehicle onCounty roads;'(6)
A petson lawfr¡lly using the target range operated by the Alameda CountySherÍff;
(7) A federal øimïnal investig,ator or law enforcement officer: or
iAi e måmner of the military forces of the State of California or of the United
states ,arrrile engaged irr the performance of his or her duty.
(S) SeverabÌlity. lf any provision ofrhis sedion or the applicatiort thereof to flY person or
circumstance is heid'¡nvalid, such invalidity shall not affect any other provision or
application of this section wh¡ch çan be give-n_effect wähout the invalid provision or
aþþt¡cation, and to this end the provisions of this sect¡on are seveEble.
sEcTloN ll
This ordinance shatt take efiect and be in force thirly (30) days from and after the date of
;å*dõ äf¡*toi* the expiration of fifteen days aner its passage it shall be published once with
tt e naînes of the *emUers'uoting for and against the same in tre lnter-Çity Ëxpress, a
newsFsper published ín the Ëounty of Alameda.
Adopted by the Board of $upervisors of the Coynty of Alameda, State of Califomia, on the 28'
day of Septernber, 1999, by the followtng called vote:
AYES:NOËS;
Supervisors Cdrson, HaggertY,ntne
EXCUSED: PresidentChan'1
AfiEST: CRYSTAL K.I.II$HIDA' CICTKof the Board of $upervisots, County of Alameda
çöu-rfty of ?\lameda, Ståte of Califomia
F a c s i m i f e R e c e i v e d o n 7 / L 8 / 2 O O 5 1 1 : 3 1 : 1 6 A M
,Donald E.J K¡: . ler, Jr.' n , , n , n
oTccou2f4 oTEJ-aat
E'f*Á*g ltt'o -tiß..ry ""/ Ø.oþrþ
October 20,1999
Via: U.S. Mail and Facsimile
Rick K. Pickering, General ManagerAlameda Counfy Fair Association4501 Pleasanton AvenuePleasanton, Califomía 9 4566
Facsimile: 925/426-7 5gg
Re: T&S Trade Show - Event Currently Scheduled forNovember 6 817
Dear Mr. Pickering:
My firm has been retained to representRuss and SallieNordyke in a lawsuit against theCounty of Alameda. I first want to thank your for extending your October 15,1999 deadline toOctober 20, 1999,, for your request that the Nordykes subräit a written plan as to how they willconduct a gun show at the Fairgrounds that will comply with the Alameda Count¡r OrdinanceNo.: 0-2000-l l .
Unfortunately, since His Honor has set a hearing on this matter for October 28,1999lacopy of that order is aftached for your records], itwill not be possible for my clients to respond toyoìrr request by that October 20, 1999 deadline. However,.T&S Trade Show intends to proceedwith the November 6 & 7 show until or unless the Judge declines to grant their request for aTemporary Restraining Order as aresult of the heanng on the 28ù of October.
In reviewing the Nordyke's contract with your organization. I cannot find any languagethat requires them to submit a written plan such as the one you requebted. They do in fact havecontractual obligations to comply with all federal, state and local laws. Flease be assured that myclients intend to comply with all of their legal obligations -both cónhactual and st4tutory.
Please feel free to contact my office if you have any questions. Thank you. '
Cordially-,
Donald E. J. Kilmer, Jr.Attorney for T&S Trade Shows
126 | Lincoln Avenue ' Suite 108San Jose, Glifomia 95125Telephone (408) 998-8489Facsimile (40S) 998:8487
f\
EXHIBIT
5hcKerinaz
0 8Ulients - via fax: 5301934-9107
I)
www alcofa irgrounds. com4501 Pleasanton Avenue . Pleasanton, CA 9+566 . (gZ5) 426-7600
January 5,2000
FAX (925) 476-7599
z
EXHIBIT
( p iI
PicVrinq +T& STradeshowsP. O. Box 871Willows CA 95988
Attention: Sallie Nordyke
Deai Sallie:
Enclosed, please;find your check #3238 in the amount of $3,790.50 which you hadsubrnitted as a deposit for 2000 event dates. As you are aware the County of Alamedahas adopted an ordinance which precludes the possession of fi¡earms on County propert!.Until such time as f g S Trade Show comes forward with a plan to comþly with thisordinancq the Fair Association can not reserve dates for thiS type of event. You werenotified byletter @ecember 10, 1999) that al! holds on 2000 dates have been released.
As shown in the statement of December 10, 1999, your deposit of $2750.00 was appliedto Invoice #227-D{ from the 1999 September show. The correct balance due on youraccount is $1,040.50. Please fonvard a check for that amount as soon as possible.
Thank you for your assistance in this matter. If you have any questions, please db not 'hesitate to call.
Very tplq yours, ,.-t l / )
/ / / , /
li útnþ (tl\4kTerri Eagan Thut,Events Coordinator
CC: Rick Pickering, General Manager
ü 9
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